Hard to start

Capt Dick Dean · Post by **Capt Dick Dean** » Dec 13th, '10, 12:58

The stb engine was always hard to start but now it's getting terrible. Good thing it's out of the water. But getting back to the situation, we have 427 c.i. engines with no choke. The "experts" at the club say the gas is draining down and after a week or so that's the problem. After a couple of weeks o sitting at the dock, I have to pour an ounce or two of petrol down the carb more than a couple of times to start.

What say you about an electric fuel pump?

And another thing. The port engine isn't that great either.

P.S. The 427's stopped production in 1972. The Irish Wake is a 1972. I really thought I had 454's and subsequently went in a depression when the truth came out.

In Memory of Vicroy · Post by **In Memory of Vicroy** » Dec 13th, '10, 13:51

Dick - before you go to the trouble to put in an electric boost pump, try installing an outboard motor type pump bulb in the fuel line in an easy-to-get-at spot....give it a few pumps before trying to start and see what ya get. Those bulbs have check valves in them so may solve your leak-down problem after one pump up.

UV

Carl · Post by **Carl** » Dec 13th, '10, 14:45

Dick...you should hang your head in shame coming here with 427's!!!

LOL...your kidding right! I know I am.

Anyway, sounds like the guys in your club are right. I have the same problem with mine. Run them every few days and they'll kick over on the first crank. Let them sit a week and it's crank crank crank for a few seconds. Do the same for the other side then when I come back they kick off.

I've thought about changing the something....I'm thinking Fuel pump (anybody??)...but it's gotten this way slowly over the past 10 years so I just know, if I don't use it...I'll have to crank a little bit.

In Memory Walter K · Post by **In Memory Walter K** » Dec 13th, '10, 16:20

I had that happen on one of my diesels and I changed everything in the line to no avail. Air was getting in there somehow over any extended period of time. We accidentally found it when my son was looking at the engine while I was cranking and spotted bubbles in my Racor bowl whenever I cranked. A hairline crack in the base of the bowl where you bolt it up. Not enough to leak fuel, but over a week, enough to lose my prime. Gas or diesel, a bit of air seepage in your fuel line and you will lose prime to gravity. Tighten everything, look for chafed areas on your line and at sharp bends.

John F. · Post by **John F.** » Dec 13th, '10, 16:31

Same thing with my 454s. You can either pump the throttle, or get a can of quickstart stuff that'll give 'em enough to fire and get the fuel moving. My drill is open boxes, look at motors, squirt quickstart stuff (no need to remove spark arrestors), go onto FB, turn on blower, start motors, go back down, look at motors (no leaks), close boxes, put ladder back on starboard box, untie lines and go. I go through maybe one can of that start stuff a year. Its cheap and easy.

Rocky · Post by **Rocky** » Dec 13th, '10, 17:43

Dick all those checks I'd do too, and don't forget the fuel pump has 2 check valves itself inside if it's a mechanical pump,could be letting fuel back into tank slowly depending on fuel level of tank were my thoughts esp. if your real low on fuel.(fuel level lower than fuel pump).
Now if those 427s were Ford side oilers you'd have the boat paid off and engines of your choice installed! The Chevy427 is no slouch of a motor either...

Skipper Dick · Post by **Skipper Dick** » Dec 13th, '10, 17:55

I'll tell you one that I was lucky to find. I was running both engines one day not long ago when my port engine started running rough then quit. Then the starboard engine did the same thing. I pulled both water separators and they were half full of air. So I put a vacume on the lines one at a time from the water separator to the siphon tube where I have the shutoffs. The vacume held just fine, so I pulled the siphon tube out of the tank and there it was. They did such a crappy job brazing the tube to the tank fitting. Then they tried to cover it up with some black crap that had obviously started to melt and weep away from the crappy job. I'd guess it was affected by the ethanol. I cleaned the crap off and finished brazing it myself and filled the pockets and holes they left and it was fixed. No problems since.

Bruce · Post by **Bruce** » Dec 13th, '10, 17:57

Fuel pumps get weak over time and if there are anti syphon valves, required on carb engines it gets tough opening that check valve.

The fastest and quickest way to solve this is shut the fuel valves off at the tank when you leave the boat on a fule drainback issue.

Once running, I'd do a fuel pump pressure check.

And if you get tired of those 427's, I'll take em.

In Memory Walter K · Post by **In Memory Walter K** » Dec 13th, '10, 18:01

Ethanol has been around long enough to have possibly degraded a fuel line just enough to let some air in too, if it's not made of the new stuff.

Tony Meola · Post by **Tony Meola** » Dec 13th, '10, 22:20

Before I repowered I had the same issue with my carb 454's. Would just pump the hell out of them before I cranked them up. They always kicked off, even if they layed there for a week.

I know you want to hang your head in shame when the guy in the Bayliner in the slip next to you cranks it up on a half turn because he is fuel injected. But remember, when it gets crappy out, he is trying to tuck in behind you so he has a comfortable ride.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Dec 14th, '10, 00:01

i told you dick to check the numbers if ending in 642 or 751 they are worth more than 10 454 engines. 427cubic inch big block by far exceeds any 454 boat motor.if 751 serial number will swap out with brand new cummins diesels

Capt Dick Dean · Post by **Capt Dick Dean** » Dec 14th, '10, 16:36

The advice is just great as always. First off, the problem is the drain back. O.K.

So, the first thing I'll try is shutting off the fuel at the tank.

Second, the outboard fuel pump trick.

And then maybe an electric pump. I have a few months to go and can't start the engine on the hard. The water is off for the winter at the yard.
But the very first thing tomorrow is to go and check the serial numbers on the engines. If there are winning numbers, then Capt Lico gets dinner every Friday night for at least a month at the McDonald's of his choice plus a cash prize!

Thanks for the advice, guys.

SteveM · Post by **SteveM** » Dec 14th, '10, 16:45

Bob, are you joking around? Or are those engines worth something to the automotive restoration guys? My 427's end in 249 and 413.

neil · Post by **neil** » Dec 14th, '10, 16:46

bob lico wrote:i told you dick to check the numbers if ending in 642 or 751 they are worth more than 10 454 engines. 427cubic inch big block by far exceeds any 454 boat motor.if 751 serial number will swap out with brand new cummins diesels

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Dec 14th, '10, 18:15

sorry no cigar. the raised cast serial numbers are located on the drivers side rear top of block. last three numbers 642 would be a 1966 oem big block corvette and 751 would be the correct number big block for a 1967 big block corvette . barrett jackson bloomington gold 98 point car with 751 block would be 200,000 with a replacement 454 block car would be around 25,000 now you figure it out .a know quite a few guys that would kiss your ass in macy`s window to get that block not running , worn out but intact. of course the cylinder heads (4350) would be additional thousands.

SteveM · Post by **SteveM** » Dec 14th, '10, 19:23

Even though mine are not the number you mention they do sound badass like an old Corvette.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Dec 14th, '10, 21:19

very carefully using a adjustable mirror look in the center of the block about two inches under the head gasket. there will be raise set of letters and two numbers at the end. this is on the passenger side of the block. incidently ALL 427 big blocks have a steel crank while the cheap cast cranks are in the 454 except hp.. and they do break .

coolair · Post by **coolair** » Dec 14th, '10, 22:45

on my ol 1969 nova had same problem, changed fuel pump fixed problem

Oh i would pay money to see bob kiss a guys ass in macys window!
man i want a vette

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Dec 14th, '10, 23:07

coolair i said i knew guys that were deperate for a correct numbered 427 i located one for in my 67 big block coupe back in 1977.fairly easy to come by back then.

Harv · Post by **Harv** » Dec 18th, '10, 09:10

All these years telling us they were 454s, now he fesses up realizing he may have gold under the engine boxes.

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