This years electronics purchase is...

Chiles · Post by **Chiles** » May 21st, '09, 14:55

Faithful,
Ok, while I am still waiting to sell my B26 so I can upgrade, I have a Grady White that I share with my father that I would like to update the electronics on.

I've learned that Radar is REALLY useful in the Chesapeak bay because of the fog that can roll in and the amount of traffic from the shipping lanes. that being said, I don't have a lot of room for black boxes, etc.

I have the Furuno Navnet color with 7" displays on the B26. I like them.

There are too many options. I'm want one single large display (all I have room for) and don't think I will be doing "bird searching" but that would be nice.

Thoughts?

Harry Babb · Post by **Harry Babb** » May 21st, '09, 16:09

Chiles
I went with Raymarine C80.
Although I have not yet installed this equipment in DeNada I have been on a boat with a friend who uses Raymarine.....it will work for me for sure!!

The display is pretty compact......and we have good support from our local distributor.

Harry

Chiles · Post by **Chiles** » May 21st, '09, 16:37

This could be a little over generalization and just *my* opinion...

Furuno makes the best radar

Garmin makes the best GPS (avionics proven)

Raymarine makes a really, really good bottom machine.

All three of these are first class manufacturers. I have had good experience with these manufacturers. All of these now have new and improved models and at different price points. I'm reading over the C80 stuff now. :)

Kevin · Post by **Kevin** » May 21st, '09, 16:54

I had the C80 on my last work boat. I did like the Radar despite the low 2 KW power. It had lots of user adjustable settings. Things I thought were nice were small target enhancement, Pulse length adjustability, mini automatic radar plotting aid and it would dim to a acceptable brightness even on the darkest of nights. I did not like the plotter.....I thought the charts were terrible so I used the garmin 276 for all navigation.

I now have some new fangle touch screen garmin for the current work boat. It does not work well for our job. Radar is less than stellar and it takes about 10 steps/screens to enter a waypoint. For some reason the charts/graphics are not the usual garmin quality. My personal Garmin 478 has nicer picture. For some reason the Garmin stuff we are using will not dim enough at night. With no moon it is like looking into car headlights. You can not put static tint on it either or the touch screen will not work. I will go as far as saying it is downright dangerous to operate at night because you can't see sh$^ it is so bright and Garmin really dropped the ball.
I have not used Furono Navnet yet but that is what we are going to. I hear it is great. I hope I gave you some things to consider before your purchase.

mike ohlstein · Post by **mike ohlstein** » May 21st, '09, 19:35

I'm installing an AIS receiver this year. Might be a nice addition for you, if you regularly ply the shiping lanes.

Harry Babb · Post by **Harry Babb** » May 21st, '09, 19:46

Chiles wrote:Furuno makes the best radar

Garmin makes the best GPS (avionics proven)

Raymarine makes a really, really good bottom machine.

I am a novist at best when it comes to electronics....but my electronic guru buddy totally agrees with the quote above but goes on to claim that Raymarine is excellent at interfacing everything.

For years and years I stumbbled all over the Gulf with a SiTex 767 and a SiTex HE30 (i think that's the number) paper bottom machine. When we were scuba diving I could find cars, stacks of auto tires and washing machines, concrete Pyramid FADs and I was actually pretty good at it.....I cannot wait until I get out there with a decent GPS and Radar. We likewise have problems with heavy fog.....sheezzz a few times I had to use braille to sneak back home....

Harry

Bruce · Post by **Bruce** » May 21st, '09, 19:58

Forget GPS. The air force is way behind on the new sats needed to keep the system working properly.

Its predicted that in a year or two the whole system will collapse.

In Memory Walter K · Post by **In Memory Walter K** » May 21st, '09, 20:50

That's why I have two Lorans as back up.

Dug · Post by **Dug** » May 22nd, '09, 05:23

Chiles,

With all due respect I am not sure that many of us would be able to tell the difference between the performance of a current model Furuno and Raymarine radar unit. Best chance of that would be side by side comparison, which few if any are going to actually do on the boat. It is kind of like tv shopping. In the store we think we can tell the difference. Get it home, and it is just a tv.

Go with the unit that is most intuitive to use for you, and that your friends are least able to mess with unintentionally. I only have one friend who really really knows how to tune my radar. The rest leave me wishing he was back from Sweden more often...

Lastly service may be an issue. If you have a good dealer for one in the area, that may make a difference despite the fact that today most just swap out a working unit for a non-working unit.

That is my blunt $0.02. I have Raymarine from 15 years ago, and I don't hit things. Usually. And if I do, it isn't the radar's fault...

Dug

JP Dalik · Post by **JP Dalik** » May 22nd, '09, 07:00

Raymarine is the weakest when it comes to networking units together. We've had more problems with these pieces when networked than any other.

Furuno Nav Net is the best.

Garmin is a close second.

Radar and Fishfinder applications have been most reliable with the Furuno installations.

Garmins radar systems are getting better however the sounders are weak

Raymarin has a nice sounder however the units are less intuitive than Garmin and Furuno.

All the manufacturers have their own ways of doing things and require a learning curve. Even the easiest of them all Northstar has their own ways of doing things.

I run all Northstar machines on the B31. The radar is good the plotter is good and the sounder is a bit weak.

My money is on Furuno for present day product.

Brewster Minton · Post by **Brewster Minton** » May 22nd, '09, 07:07

JP is right on. Furuno.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » May 22nd, '09, 09:19

dug funny as you should mention that (comparison furumo and raymarime) i will tell you in a few hours. i can say one thing the furumo system i am about to use is in a 45' cabo my friend just purchase . they removed the raymarine and install the lastest and greatest furumo nav net 3d . the cost was 20,000 dollars do you want pictures??? i will take this baby out the inlet wot . the wave should be cresting about 1pm . lets see this radar at 38mph!!! he removed raymarine (3 - E-120 ) . i am no expert here but if price is no object they only use the garmin machine (as a fourth unit)because of the ability to have instant sea temperature displayed on overall chart . gps heading is translated to satalite instantatnious temperature to find temperature break at that minute.the owner is suit and tie dude and ask to go fishing for stripers well i can`t hep him with that!!! but i have a local to teach him the ropes .

Bruce · Post by **Bruce** » May 22nd, '09, 15:22

Funny on the Ray Marine stuff.

I've networked a bunch of their stuff, mostly E120 units and have had zero issues.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » May 22nd, '09, 18:19

i stand corrected; the furumo setup was $30,000 they gave him $10,000 for his existing electronics. first i want to compare apples to apples don`t tell me you have this 1980 raymarine unit that won`t talk to another new unit.the only way to compare is to use raymarine open array 4kw or 10 kw don`t want to act like a snob but domes just don`t cut it ! with all do respect the raymarine high definition radar and the furuno 6kw were identical . the advantage of the 3 -12" furumo units over the raymarine e-120 10" is nice but raymarine makes a 12" now so that is no advantage.the raymarine sonar with the black box high definition is just as good as the million dollar furumo unit.i am going to give a definite edge to the nav net in 3d over the plainum card navionics in the raymarine. CMI is the electronic go to guy at oakdale yacth. you have a raymarine/furumo problem he is there the next day . i ask about the the raymarine talk to each other problem and he look at me like i had two heads ---where the fu-k did you hear that nonsense probally a diy moron!!!!

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » May 22nd, '09, 19:10

yep e-120 is 12" the new 14" is offered in c-series .bruce pointed out future problems with gps well there are problems with raymarine,furumo,garmin and anybody else offering sirrus radio and weather that display onscreen. the satelite system is just not that dependable especially if you really are depending on that weather to remain offshore.

JP Dalik · Post by **JP Dalik** » May 23rd, '09, 09:32

Hey Bob,

where the fu-k did you hear that nonsense probally a diy moron!!!!

I'm hoping that was a quote from the "uber installer"on Long Island.

If not we have a problem.

Wonder why the Cabo guy ripped all the Raymarine product out. Must of been installed by a hack huh.

Wonder why we're pulling E series out and upgrading to Furuno here. More hack installs I guess.

Raymarine has been the worst from our experience, sorry.

Un-networked stand alone units work , my feeling is that Furuno is still king of the hill for stand alone and networked all in one machines. I believe this due to the few return calls we have on full Nav Net installs vs other manufacturers systems. Again stand alone units are not where the issues have come into play.

Chiles good luck to you. Hope the information helps.

Chiles · Post by **Chiles** » May 23rd, '09, 16:55

I've always leaned towards Furuno but all of these units carry a big price tag.

I'm not sure i want to spend the bucks on a 3-D unit. After all, this is the Grady and not the Bert. :)

Hey Timmy, you got any left over electronics from the Tubbb? Sell them to me cheap.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » May 23rd, '09, 17:52

jp the guy with the 45'cabo has very deep pockets he could have bought a 70' bertram but the river that oakdale yacth is located at can only take a 41/2' draft .he ask me what the very best was (price no object) i told him furuno so he did it up mainly because i show him the 3d nav net on another boat. the three nav net 12" screen along side each other and one on the buggy up top looks real sweet all lit up . they was absolutely nothing wrong with the raymarine other then the fact it was not 3d.
cmi electronic from lindenhurst long island is the top gun of both raymarine and furomo and his feeling on the raymarine was if there not working together you did not install it right don`t blame raymarine. did you bring the gps input 0183 into the smart heading sensor or did you splice it and feed auto pilot, e-120 at the same time? are you going with raytalk or using the 2000 talk between componets? you can screw up the nav net also. both companies can`t master the sirrus/weather on line go with garmin. simrad is the easeist radar to use but can`t go overlay with chart while moving for some a big disavantage. as a stand alone 31 bertram unit the c-120 with digital black box sonar and 4kw open array is hard tro beat . i have to say from a very active marina with over 1200 customers those guys in manchester (raymarine) are the absolute best. call tech. help and they will walk you thru anything while your on the cell phone .any part in 24 hours .i like furuno but i am not going to bad mouth raymarine !!!!

JP Dalik · Post by **JP Dalik** » May 23rd, '09, 19:02

Happy Bass Fishing Bob.

Chiles since its only a Grady, might as well go hummingbird (lol)

coolair · Post by **coolair** » May 24th, '09, 12:37

Heres my 2 cents
Furuno has had the best radar and fish finders, my bro fishes for for a living, and thats what he uses as a sounder, but I went with the garmin unit, its touch screen, and very user friendly. the furuno/garmin/raymarine rep here said any one who buys a navnet3d and doest get some sort of "training" will be very unhappy. and the navnet2 apparently has issues with the track ball.
Now, the garmin is not repairable. if it breaks you send it in, and they give you a new one for a "fee" the furuno can be repaired and fixed and made to live almost forever if you want to spend the money. which is one of the big advantage of the furuno, but they are more expensive.

luis · Post by **luis** » May 25th, '09, 08:28

Bruce wrote:Forget GPS. The air force is way behind on the new sats needed to keep the system working properly.

Its predicted that in a year or two the whole system will collapse.

Did you ever try to take a reading on a sextant , aboard a 31 , 50 miles out with a poor weather ? ehehehe!
Greatings

bertram31.com

This years electronics purchase is...

This years electronics purchase is...

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