upping the hp on a cummins bt210

joelmcquen · Post by **joelmcquen** » May 5th, '08, 12:17

got a pair of running but high hour bt 210 given to me .but for my boat projects i need more hp what can i do to increase the hp like bore , change injectors , swap injection pumps , ???? and how much will it cost. if i can do it at all i am a very good mechanic and have a freind with a machine shop so lets here what you think

In Memory Walter K · Post by **In Memory Walter K** » May 5th, '08, 13:09

I have a pair of 210's in my Bertram 31. Don't know what your expectations/needs are, but don't sell those engines short as far as power goes. In the days of early ownership, I asked the same question. Ours are turbocharged. The 250's and 270's are Turbocharged and aftercooled. I was told its not a simple add-on as it sounds as there are other subtle differences in the injector pump and the injectors as well as need for increased engine cooling. They are the basic Cummins block and are bulletproof. I get 22kts @ 7 gph per engine. The key to getting the most out of them is proper propping. Walter

In Memory of Vicroy · Post by **In Memory of Vicroy** » May 5th, '08, 13:14

As Walter says, its really not practical to increase the hp on these engines....I have the 250s and in addition to the aftercoler, the cam is different, the cooling system is beefier, the head is different and of course the injector pump is different.

A similar (or maybe the same) question was posted up recenty on boatdisel.com and the real experts (Tony Athens, Paul, etc.) explained why, although in theory possible, its just not practical.

UV

jspiezio · Post by **jspiezio** » May 5th, '08, 14:03

free engines and 22 kts @ 7gph, How much more can you ask for?

Ironman · Post by **Ironman** » May 5th, '08, 14:05

You have the perfect cores for a "recons"
Rumor is you cant get the recons without a pair or engines in a running.
boat...
Wayne

Tony Meola · Post by **Tony Meola** » May 5th, '08, 21:11

Wayne

You can get the recons without having diesels. I am swapping out my gas engines for the 270 recons. I believe the deal is, it just has to a repower replacing an exisiting engine. Can not be used in a new truck, or boat. At least that's what Cummins told me.

Tony

jspiezio · Post by **jspiezio** » May 5th, '08, 22:26

I don't want to sound stupid, although I seem to do so more and more often, but, wouldyou guys give more details on Cummins recons. I could not find info during a google search.

nic · Post by **nic** » May 6th, '08, 02:21

Search Cummins Remans for "re-manufactured", add Tony Athens...he's the go-to guy.

Nic

jspiezio · Post by **jspiezio** » May 6th, '08, 04:54

Thanks Nic

Bruce · Post by **Bruce** » May 6th, '08, 06:47

Detroit 2 cycle engine are just about the easiest to up the HP.
They don't have an injection pump like most other diesels. They use a high volume pump to deliver fuel to the injector, all injectors at the same time.
A rocker arm fires the injector at the time its needed. By increasing the CC voulume of the injector, your on your way to more HP.

Conventional injection pump design makes it difficult to increase volume without changing the whole pump and injectors.

Aftercoolers to cool the incomming air also is important as is turbo boost and volume.

But it gets to the point on most where cost does not justify the change.

The 170/240 hp yanmar 4 cylinders are like this.

Now most engines can be tweaked as they are for a slight change in HP. In some cases as much as 15 to 30 hp.

Any really good Cummins tech should be able to get a few more hp out of the stock setup witout much trouble. Depends on if a few more is enough.

DRIFTER31 · Post by **DRIFTER31** » May 6th, '08, 10:00

I bought my Cummins re-cons from Johnsons Diesel in Biloxi Miss 228-392-1311 David is the owner and was cheapest in my three state region. Paid 12600.00ea for the 220re-mans.

tds8268 · Post by **tds8268** » May 6th, '08, 13:12

Joel,

A pair of 210's with zf gears turning 20 x 22 three blade, 24 knots @ 2400 and I carry 1500 lbs of lead in the boat. Don't sell the 210's short, they run forever without many headaches. Nearly 5000 hrs and still ruuning strong.

Dan
www.finchasersportfishing.com

In Memory Walter K · Post by **In Memory Walter K** » May 6th, '08, 14:19

Dan, mine are Twin Discs 1:52's and my props presently are Nibral 20X20's slightly cupped cruising at 2400 rpms I get 22 kts. Given my no-load WOT is 2650. I've been upping my pitch an inch at a time over the years and still get WOT under load of 2650. What you're telling me is that I probably can go even further. Thanks. Walter

Dug · Post by **Dug** » May 6th, '08, 15:13

I know a great way to up the horsepower on those engines.

Sell them to someone who will appreciate them for what they are, and then buy what you think you want.

Dug

tds8268 · Post by **tds8268** » May 6th, '08, 19:55

Walter,

With my 20 x 22 nibrals I can turn 2625 wot. Some might say that too low, but my engine hours say it's fine. Our reduction is just about the same on our gears.

Dan

Tony Meola · Post by **Tony Meola** » May 6th, '08, 21:24

If you call Tony Athens he is going to tell you the 270's are not availble. For some reason he has trouble getting them. They do exist, I know that since mine are sitting on the shop floor right now at Forked River Diesel and Generator.

Basically from what I understand, they are new engines with some rebuilt parts. Could be fuel and water pumps etc. They do not meet the EPA regs. for new boats and trucks but can be used repowers. The cost of the 270's is about $5,000 less per engine than the new ones. Could be more by now.

Good luck in your engine hunt.

DRIFTER31 · Post by **DRIFTER31** » May 10th, '08, 10:47

One note on re-cons from Cummins. My local Cummins Mid South dealership tried to get cores from me before the sale or charge x-tra for not having them. Guess what ... Johnsons Diesel was honest and told me that Cummins DID NOT require a core so i purchased two from him for being honest. I traveled a state away and saved 4000. on the pair

Tony Meola · Post by **Tony Meola** » May 11th, '08, 21:41

Drifter

That sounds like a dealer to stay away from.

scot · Post by **scot** » May 12th, '08, 22:40

Bruce said:

Detroit 2 cycle engine are just about the easiest to up the HP.
They don't have an injection pump like most other diesels. They use a high volume pump to deliver fuel to the injector, all injectors at the same time.
A rocker arm fires the injector at the time its needed. By increasing the CC voulume of the injector, your on your way to more HP.

Bruce, Another little trick I learned a couple of weeks ago (unofficial, but from one of the largest DD distributors in the world). When adding horse power by installing a turbo on a Detroit you can run the turbo style liners and use the natural style 19:1 pistons...all is well and the engines start much easier! It's not in any manuals but 3 old school DD mechanics concured and noted they had done this many, many times over the years. I ask about the turbo size and they told me "you can't put too much air in a Detroit, but you can put too much HOT air in one". Add an aftercooler!

bertram31.com

upping the hp on a cummins bt210

upping the hp on a cummins bt210

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