What are the chances

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Mar 22nd, '20, 14:15

My boat was stolen last night, the thieves couldn’t figure out how to open the sea cocks. The engines overheated and they ditched it. It seems the only damage done was to the engines but that remains to be seen.

Here is the real kicker they left the boat, not tied up in a boat slip in someone’s back yard, the owner was nice enough to track me down before I even knew the boat was missing. Must have happened last night he found it this morning. Not only is this person a Bertram owner but one of our own. John Spiezio.

Police report, insurance claim, Sea tow and marina all working under this modified schedule stay tuned it will be interesting.

kross1 · Post by **kross1** » Mar 22nd, '20, 14:52

Peter
Wow thats not good. Hope it all works out for you.

kross1 · Post by **kross1** » Mar 22nd, '20, 14:57

Peter
I’m on the same canal as you.I know there’s a B 25 on a lift down from you. Just curious if that were it was.
Any chance of cameras in your parking lot?

Dug · Post by **Dug** » Mar 22nd, '20, 15:01

OMG!!!! Serious????? Holy s#$t!!!!!!

pschauss · Post by **pschauss** » Mar 22nd, '20, 15:25

Peter,

Sorry to hear that.

FWIW, the guys who were driving my boat for her previous owner were running the port engine with a blown heat exchanger when I bought her. After two seasons and about 40 hours running time, I have not seen any evidence of damage to the engine.

Regards,
Peter

Carl · Post by **Carl** » Mar 22nd, '20, 15:50

Wow! On every level.

things you just can't make up as it sounds so unbelievable.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Mar 22nd, '20, 16:27

The house it was at has the modified 31 Bahia mar that is on a lift. With the rudders mounted on the transom.

Will have sea tow take me over to the boat yard this week, will have to have it looked at and have an adjuster come down. I really don’t want to be chasing problems because of this. They had enough problems with the motors to abort the trip. I didn’t touch them. Will be cautious and ask the insurance company for as much as possible.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Mar 22nd, '20, 16:36

The police asked if I had a camera on the boat, which I don’t. Plenty of mansions between where the boat traveled and I’m sure many have video but the police isn’t going to be going door to door asking.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Mar 22nd, '20, 17:24

Was msging Dug, which bring up an interesting question.

In the middle of this social distancing, with a night that was dropping below freezing and a cabin that can easily be broken into, but they didn’t bother; new electronics which were not stolen. And given the fact that they know how to even start the engines and look for seacocks. I have a super hard time believing we are talking about kids looking for a joy ride. But feel free to counter my opinion.

So assuming it wasn’t a joy ride. What does someone do with a 50 year old boat 31 foot boat with gas Motors. What could be the motivation or the plan? It’s really puzzling. It doesn’t have enough fuel to go that far, fuel docks aren’t open, marinas aren’t open and putting it on a trailer would require removing the top and leaving Long Island via on the major NYC bridges.

Since we are not on a CSI show the police write a report up call it a day. The insurance company will surely take my word that it was stolen and not ask any other questions. I’m interested in anyone that has a theory or even imagine an unrealistic motiv that is slightly plausible.

Amberjack · Post by **Amberjack** » Mar 22nd, '20, 17:31

Peter-How did they start the boat? Did they find keys or hotwire it?

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Mar 22nd, '20, 17:57

I don’t have keys; if you turn the battery switch on and flip the switches you can start the motors. I ever thought of it as a security issue since both the underside of the dash and engine compartments are accessible anyway. But really perplexed how they’d know that.

ktm_2000 · Post by **ktm_2000** » Mar 22nd, '20, 18:55

I'm sorry to hear of your problems but if they weren't stealing parts or knowledgeable enough to check the sea-cocks I would think that some teenagers took your boat for a joyride.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Mar 22nd, '20, 19:44

They did open the hatches looking for the seacocks but you have to feel for them or know where they are, they aren’t visible.

Tony Meola · Post by **Tony Meola** » Mar 22nd, '20, 20:24

Peter

That is unbelievable. Thank god they did not get far with it and hopefully it will just be an water pump impeller that needs to be replaced.

That would be a hard boat to sell on the open market. Perhaps they were planning on Shipping it to South America or some place like that. Not really worth stripping it unless they wanted the electronics and engines. Or it was going to be used for running drugs.

Years ago a friend of mine sold his 25 foot outboard, it showed up several years later abandoned in a Florida swamp.. Still had the NY Registration numbers on her so it was traced to him. When he got the call the State was looking for him to pay salvage costs. They told him it was probably being used to run drugs.

If you can, move the battery switch's into the cabin under the seat. Make it harder for the next person. Then if they are run through the 12 volt panel, make sure you turn those breakers off. When I had the gas engines I always turned off the engine breakers as well as the battery switch's.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Mar 22nd, '20, 20:48

did the police "dust" the boat for prints? there is very little boat traffic somebody had to notice it going down the canal.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Mar 22nd, '20, 20:48

Thanks Tony. I’m a bit mixed, if the boat disappeared it is insured for replacement value so I’m not sure if I lucked out or not. As for keys or an interior switch of some kind, if these guys really knew what they were doing I’d have a broken window, busted door or torn up wiring in addition to the engine problems.

I’m certainly going to have to rethink this now.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Mar 22nd, '20, 20:51

No dusting the boat for prints Bob, they took a statement from me at my house and it doesn’t seem they’ll be doing any further investigation unless it happens to someone else too. I’m free to have the boat towed to the marina for repairs.

DanielM · Post by **DanielM** » Mar 22nd, '20, 23:02

Peter, could be drug related.

There was a twin diesel north coast 31 near me that was stolen. Story was the guy that stole it owed money to a drug runner. Drug runner needed a boat for a 1 time pick up and drop off here on the coast, so the guy stole a boat to even up the debt. The thief knew enough about boats to run the boat down the intercoastal several miles, but wound up running it up on a mud flat. He couldn’t get it off the mud flat and left it there in the mud with the newly rebuilt Cummins 330hp still running and burned them up.

I guess the thief got caught on that one or no one would know why it wound up miles away on a mud flat. That was the story I was told. Any way the owner got his boat back but the engines and running gear were toast. So maybe drug running, that or kids/drunks joy riding.

Sorry to hear you had to go through that, hope insurance takes care of you on the motors.

Yannis · Post by **Yannis** » Mar 23rd, '20, 02:47

I personally would never even imagine that the seacocks would be shut. Once I managed to start the engines, I’d assume that I’m ok to pursue my evil task.
Unfortunately, I don't know the geography of your area so as to provide anything tangible, however, you might want to figure out where these guys would aim going if the engines didn't overheat and led to the abandonment of the boat.
Go meet someone for a ride? A date? Load and transport something? Is there any info of recent illegal activity in the vicinity that led to your boat being used as an escape vehicle? Are there any traces of vandalism in nearby boats that would suggest that your boat was not a target, rather it was the first one to start? Can you tell by the shoe prints or other evidence how many they were?

No doubt all this will keep you busy for a while, I wish you the best of luck.

Carl · Post by **Carl** » Mar 23rd, '20, 06:31

All these older boats are somewhat familiar.
It doesn't take much to find battery and switches, ignition on lots of the older boats is a simple switch...if key start many dashes and panels open in seconds to jump. I get some are thinking you need to be a mastermind to "hot wire" a boat. But boats tend to be wide open and easily accessible so someone with a little bit of knowledge.

Think about it...engines are accessible by opening hatches. Dash is lift out, pull out or with a large panel to gain access. To get inside...Cabin locks are a joke...wiggle some of the handles enough they open. Some windows slide open, others easily broken or pulled out. Buddies boat had a large window next to the door, window was siliconed in...till they pulled it out, reached in and tried to open the cabin door. They couldn't so just yanked really hard breaking the wooden frame. They didn't take his boat...but lots of stuff inside was gone. Some owners leave keys around under panels or just leave boat open.

As to the why...If your area is anything like mine. Streets are secluded, bars are closed, young people are bored...boat is just sitting there.

I'm guessing by the time the overheat alarms went off they just wanted to get off the boat ASAP and spent very little time looking for seacocks...besides with any boat knowledge they knew the impellers would have been toast by that time even if they found them.

Guy in my club had his boat broken into this winter. They took all his good poles, reels, tackle, electronics. He had police dust his boat, although they advised against it as it is messy as hell. They found the owners prints and a bunch of smudged partial ones...but prints only work if the people are in the data base or in the system. He told me the mess they made with the powder was beyond belief.

To take boat to sell or part out...I doubt it too much risk for very little reward. Drug deal...maybe they wanted to blend in with an older boat. Although its a pretty stand out boat and a bad choice in my opinion.

Lousy feeling...had my boat broken into once and my car once.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Mar 23rd, '20, 06:56

After a winter sitting, I’d generally once everything over even knowing how to properly do things including opening the sea cocks. Wouldn’t dare attempt a real trip right out of the box, my wife even laughed, we have a 50% chance of a successful day on the water with the necessary prep.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Mar 23rd, '20, 10:32

due to my wife`s health condition I have not been active with my law enforcement ties so i will inquire today but they have their hands full right now.I know of a strange order given to highway patrol (let food delivery trucks roll unimpeded ! like 85 mph in the middle lane of LIE. wow) right now you have a" stolen and return boat " an insurance issue otherwise we sent out the "good old boys" with ,
a chain and cement block to the Hudson drop off.

kross1 · Post by **kross1** » Mar 23rd, '20, 11:20

Peter
Yes that is the boat I was talking about I was just a little confused. Old age.
So how do you go forward with this do you have to try and start the engines to figure out problems? Maybe change impeller’s first and then start?

Mark · Post by **Mark** » Mar 23rd, '20, 14:55

Peter,
Sorry to hear. Hopefully, no significant damage. It was pretty windy here in Central Jersey Saturday night into Sunday. Hopefully it wasn't bouncing around the slip too much. You'll want to try and identify everything as soon as possible to the insurance company but it is up to you to identify all damage. Check wiring and hoses in engine compartment. Excessive heat could shorten their life or cause issues. I'm sure you are doing this but check the non-obvious for damage too. Who knows what they were doing while onboard and what damage that would have incurred. It seems like a short period of time, though. Being at night, they could have also hit bottom somewhere or damaged running gear. You should have it hauled. Even if the paint was damage, that should be included. Look for new stress cracks or gouges in fiberglass. If the are any, it needs to be restored back to pre-loss condition, meaning if there are no color discolorations, you shouldn't have any post loss. (Would be more important if you hull or topside were painted. ) Check your cushions, make sure they are not stained from the event (if they already had stains, insurance won't cover new stains). Check other plumbing. Hopefully they didn't use toilet for themselves or other contraband. Might need to clean holding tank to just re-winterize. Check the details of your policy to make sure you know what you are entitled. If you don't have a full copy, your agent or the company must be able to provide you with full copy. If you ask for one, make sure you ask for a "certified" copy. This means that it is specific to your policy and coverages and not just a generic copy.

Good luck!
Mark

Bob H. · Post by **Bob H.** » Mar 23rd, '20, 14:59

Sorry to hear about your 31... that is a horrible feeling. Hope you get it
Back up n running for the summer.

pschauss · Post by **pschauss** » Mar 23rd, '20, 15:10

Peter,

Just curious, is your marina allowed to work under the current New York State lockdown rules?

Bruce · Post by **Bruce** » Mar 23rd, '20, 16:43

Law enforcement rarely prints for theft unless it involves some type of bodily harm. Even if you have video from homes recording the event, doubt they would pursue it especially since you got the boat back.

Might think hidden ignition kill switches. Behind galley draw is where I used to place them. Just on the ignition though. Let em crank, thieves will think you just have a start issue and leave never looking for hidden ignition toggles.

pschauss · Post by **pschauss** » Mar 23rd, '20, 16:59

The master battery switch in the trunk of my Austin-Healey also grounds the points-side of the coil to kill the ignition when you shut off the battery. You could do something similar on a boat.

Harry Woods · Post by **Harry Woods** » Mar 23rd, '20, 17:08

Peter,
Sorry to hear about your stolen boat. It reminded me of a sign at another area marina that read as follows:
PROPERTY PROTECTED BY GUARD DOGS THREE NIGHTS A WEEK.
GUESS WHICH THREE.

Harry

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Mar 23rd, '20, 17:55

Thanks for the kind words and suggestions.

Long statement to the insurance Co. luckily all my mechanical records were done by one marina who saves all the work receipts on a computer. As far as what they told me, nothing gets touched until the adjuster shows up. I will make sure to be there and make sure they tear down as much as possible to check for damage.

I can only hope for minimal damage or a total loss on the engines.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Mar 23rd, '20, 18:19

In terms of the adjuster and the marinas working under the current state here. I’m really not sure I think they’re both exempt from the stay home orders but honestly not so concerned. Everything is on lockdown so I’m guessing because of this I’ll be up and running before I otherwise would have.

ktm_2000 · Post by **ktm_2000** » Mar 23rd, '20, 20:33

our house got broken into a couple years back, the thief took quite a bit. The cops didn't give a care until I figured out a gun was missing. My brother was going through rough times and I had been storing his guns with mine and all didn't fit in to the gun safe. I left the cheapest bolt action rifle outside the safe with a trigger lock on it and had taken the bolt out and had that in the safe.

The thief took the rifle without the bolt, made no attempt on the safe.

I opened the gun safe for the cops and showed them the lack of space and showed them the bolt. A detective was there the following day, no good prints anywhere.

Hopefully all works out for you and insurance can make you whole

Bertramp · Post by **Bertramp** » Mar 24th, '20, 05:38

Pete ....
Sorry to hear this. I know EXACTLY where you keep your boat.

Engines will probably be alright.
My non-mechanical brain would say impellors, hoses, oil and filters, maybe heads ?

Insurance companies (my prior to retirement bean counting was done in the insurance industry) work under the concept of indemnification (bringing you back to where you were before the "event")
They wont look at it as "well its a Bertram and since they don't make a 31 anymore, we'll have to give him a new 35".

I gotta think kids for a joy-ride.
You cant trailer it anywhere without being noticed (you saw my boat on the LIE).
Even if they had access to fuel, you cant run fast and far enough to not be seen by someone once the word gets out ...... the hull is BLUE !!

Good luck in getting her back together quickly .... I know you just spent a lot of time doing electrical work.
All the best !!

John F. · Post by **John F.** » Mar 24th, '20, 09:32

Pete

Sorry to hear. Good luck with getting her up and running

John

HydroRacer · Post by **HydroRacer** » Mar 24th, '20, 11:13

Peter ,
Sorry to hear about your misfortune . Glad you got your boat back though .
" dust for prints " , that's a joke in Suffolk County from what my Surgeon neighbor told me about long island . He had a sociopath neighbor who was calling his house every night for 2 weeks , one call after another not saying anything ( teenage daughter at home from college ) ; ultimately trying to get the Dr. to threaten him ; i'm sure he was recording his harassing phone calls to get the Dr. in trouble for threatening to harm him , nice try . My neighbor had Verizon do a trace & was successful and he went down to the precinct with the case # and they said there was nothing they could do !! They did not even get off their chair to help.
Peter , i see you live in babylon . That place is a toxic cancer cluster ; get out of there ! My neighbor moved out here to Vail & never looked back , he never had a good thing to say about that island ( bad roads , corrupt politicians , arrogant people , apathetic overpaid cops ect... ). Make sure you have a few signed , shielded pba cards & maybe you have a chance .

bob, didn't you say on a previous post that your brother is a sheriff there on long island ? Take a second and call him up & help Peter out .

Good Luck !

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Mar 24th, '20, 14:53

Suffolk county police matter, not the Sheriffs dept.
i spoke with someone way up the chain of command on this matter and mention the fact that with fear of the CORONA issue dispathing a detective along the waterfront for eyewitness account would not be in best interest due to the boat being returned an insurance issue and yes they will dust any grand larceny. especially if there is a pattern like multi.burglary with similar entry.

CamB25 · Post by **CamB25** » Mar 24th, '20, 15:18

Wow! Sorry to here this, Peter! Do you have some sort of agreed value insurance on the boat?

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Mar 24th, '20, 17:48

I have an agreed value on the boat but it is greater then the cost to replace those engines. Doesn’t seem to be any apparent damage beyond mechanical. So it’s going to be a matter of the engines being fixed or a check to replace them.

The ignition switches were left on and the motors were in gear with some throttle. Probably they left it running and the motors eventually stopped running during the night.

HydroRacer · Post by **HydroRacer** » Mar 24th, '20, 17:58

So bob , are you telling me your brother is not a sheriff in suffolk county , NY ??

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Mar 24th, '20, 18:19

HydroRacer wrote:Peter ,
Sorry to hear about your misfortune . Glad you got your boat back though .
" dust for prints " , that's a joke in Suffolk County from what my Surgeon neighbor told me about long island . He had a sociopath neighbor who was calling his house every night for 2 weeks , one call after another not saying anything ( teenage daughter at home from college ) ; ultimately trying to get the Dr. to threaten him ; i'm sure he was recording his harassing phone calls to get the Dr. in trouble for threatening to harm him , nice try . My neighbor had Verizon do a trace & was successful and he went down to the precinct with the case # and they said there was nothing they could do !! They did not even get off their chair to help.
Peter , i see you live in babylon . That place is a toxic cancer cluster ; get out of there ! My neighbor moved out here to Vail & never looked back , he never had a good thing to say about that island ( bad roads , corrupt politicians , arrogant people , apathetic overpaid cops ect... ). Make sure you have a few signed , shielded pba cards & maybe you have a chance .

bob, didn't you say on a previous post that your brother is a sheriff there on long island ? Take a second and call him up & help Peter out .

Good Luck !

I happen to love my toxic cancer cluster, it’s not perfect but as toxic cancer clusters go it ranks pretty high.

Tony Meola · Post by **Tony Meola** » Mar 24th, '20, 20:44

Peter

If they left those engines running they probably cooked themselves. Would not be surprised if they seized up. UGH! Not good.

Push the insurance company to buy you two new ones.

As I thought about securing the boat, I would think about shutting the fuel line off when you leave the boat. The engines will start, but stall then just crank. I doubt they would take the time to try and turn the fuel back on.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Mar 24th, '20, 22:11

hydro racer he is my brother as in best friend now with his son who is a Sheriff in Palm beach county.

HydroRacer · Post by **HydroRacer** » Mar 25th, '20, 07:01

Peter ,

lol , i hear the beaches are nice though ! Didn't you say recently that you had some medical issues /surgery ? I hope that all worked out well for you .

bob ,
Oh , i thought he was an actual brother . Palm Beach is very nice , we did a few commercial projects there before i retired , also a couple of Motor Yacht projects @ Bradford Shipyard in Ft. Lauderdale. Great facility and really nice people to deal with . I thought you were moving to Florida ?
Yes , the local leo is important but i live & prepare but the saying " when seconds matter the police are minutes away " , more relevant today more than ever .

I just read that 7.6 % of the NYPD called in sick , it's about to get nasty in NY .

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Mar 25th, '20, 07:14

Tony Meola wrote:Peter

If they left those engines running they probably cooked themselves. Would not be surprised if they seized up. UGH! Not good.

Push the insurance company to buy you two new ones.

As I thought about securing the boat, I would think about shutting the fuel line off when you leave the boat. The engines will start, but stall then just crank. I doubt they would take the time to try and turn the fuel back on.

Tony if the engines are toast I’ll likely use the insurance money to help fund diesels but that’s wishful thinking. My luck they’ll be repairable and I will be chasing gremlins for months.

MikeMilligan · Post by **MikeMilligan** » Mar 25th, '20, 08:41

F*ck, what's going on.

neil · Post by **neil** » Mar 25th, '20, 10:05

Peter,I like the Idea of putting the money towards a pair of cummings

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Mar 25th, '20, 10:18

peter i promise i will get you a pair of Cummins 6bta-m3 . mine Cummins are running for 15 years with a simple belt tensioner replacement ($59,00) and so will yours. no promises on gears you may have to buy out right.

DanielM · Post by **DanielM** » Mar 25th, '20, 21:45

Peter,

In regard to what Steve mentioned above about the purpose of insurance being to bring you back to where you were before the event. I think I’d lean hard into the narrative that part of your loss is the worry with the unknown variables around what the long term damage ramifications could be. (The gremlins you mention) I’m not much of a mechanic but I would think you’d need a rebuild to understand any damage that could have been done to the heads or block. Warped heads? Block needing milled? Even if it isn’t apparent at this time the damage may be there? Again I’m not a mechanic so I might be out in the weeds. Perhaps the depreciated value of the gas motors may be less than the repair and they cover you for that amount. Not a lot, but a start toward some diesels. Just my thinking, your adjuster might not see it that way.

Again sorry you have to deal with this. Especially when you guys are getting hammered up there in NY with the virus. Hang in there. As far as the virus we’re all in this together, as we’re starting to see a fair amount of cases in Houston, but my thoughts and prayers are with you guys in NY. Y'all are really on the leading edge of this thing.

BTW if you get bored of your toxic cancer cluster up there, come visit me in my toxic cancer cluster down here on petrochemical gulf coast. The redfish are twice as easy to catch when they have two heads!! lol.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Mar 26th, '20, 06:43

Thanks for the kind words. Starboard motor was replace last year and the port engine in 2015. I have all the purchase and installation receipts. It’s not a ton of money but if the motors have to be replaced it’s a good start. This never seems to be my luck. I can only assume they’re repairable and it will take forever to determine that.

For those of you that are doing your own work this is probably a good reminder to chat with your insurance agent about making sure upgrades are documented to their liking.

Bob I hope to have to take you up on that offer and Daniel would love to see your toxic cancer cluster someday.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Mar 26th, '20, 10:56

peter my contact has a pair of " storm block" Cummins @ 370hp each. that would be 2005 or newer with 1 one year 100% replacement.gears are another story i will check. engines are in NJ.