Deck re-coreing

[gplume]

All-

Have a non B 31 one question that i need to solicit the collective wisdom of the guys on this site. In short, my new boat is a 41 DeFever trawler/cruiser. A common issue with thes boats is rotted core under the treak decks and the one i have is no exception. Apparenly water leaks in thru the screw holes that hold the deck down and rots the balsa wood core. Am in the proces of removing the teak and subsequrnt fiberglass cover so i can replace the core. Looking fo suggestions on what to recore with.

Suggested to me was to use nida core. I am thinking of something like coosa board....i think what we get locally here is called "penske" board.

Any thoughts on the optimum core material? Pro's/con's?

[CaptPatrick]

Gif,

Coosa and Penske are virtually the same product... I'd opt for that over the Nida core.

Good luck on the upgrade, that's a hellofa' big job. I hate any builder that used balsa core in a horizontal manner...

[Pete Fallon]

Giff,
I have surveyed a bunch of DeFever's over the years, some were good some were real bad, all had rot in the deck core especially on the aft deck area. Bruce and I did a job on a 43' trawler in Jacksonville, Fl. a few years ago, it had rat's living in the engine room, a wiring nightmare in the 110/12 volt panel in the salon, the 12 volt was melted to the 110 service, a leaking black iron fuel tank and a real bad fiberglass hurricane damage repair on the starboard stern quarter. I asked the broker about the listing and all the problems , his reply was "what do you expect for $200K". Needless to say my client did not buy the boat.

Another 53' I did in St. Pete had a crack in the keel under the bilge covering boards on the center line in the engine room, the owner asked me if that was the reason his pump was always coming on, he didn't know that the covering board lifted up for access, he had owned the boat for over 2 years, he had a bunch of boat yard monkeys look at it but they could never find the leak , never had the boat surveyed before he bought it, needless to say another sale down the tubes.

Be prepared for chasing at lot of rotted deck core, also check for window leaks especially on the side windows in the salon, the hull is really well built, the rest of the boat should be okay, the boat is a high maintenance compared to a 31' Bertram. Happy holidays.
Pete Fallon

[gplume]

Pete-

Thanks for the preview of coming attactions. I have to agree, definately a lot more potential maintenance issues than a B-31.
Had a lot of time to think about this one as it was a family deal. Its my Dads old boat, so some sentimental investment for me. Honestly the B-31 is more rugged in some respects, and less in otheres. I stripped bottom on both boats when I got them, so I got a good view on how they are both put together. The Bertram had more blisters, but to be fair had a lot tougher life. In terms of construction, I have to say the Bertram is a more rugged, but has some "soft spots" as does the DeFever. That said, the Defever is no slouch. Original gel coat (30 year old ) is still nearly pristine, and hull,is solid. For both boats I replaced every seacock, and filled and fared every blister, as well as barrer coated both. The glass is thicker in some areas and less in others on the B 31. My view at first was to expect more from the DeFever than the Bertram.....That said, the DeFever is a 7-8 knot boat, so the fact that the DeFever is about the same in glass thickness relative to the B 31 does not bother me now as the Bertram is designed for more speed,u

Where I see bigger diferentiation is with some of the sub systems. Black Iron fuel tanks...what were they thinking? The whole teak deck set up is stupid, and designed to fail. Bonding is horrible on the Defever. Wiring is ok on the DeFevef, but lots of updates planned.

In the end different boats for different purposes. Going to have to deal with the shortcomings to keep,the family boat going.

Patrick-
Thanks on the feedback. Basically you confirmed my thinking.

Br
Giff

[Pete Fallon]

Giff,
I agree with the sentimental value of certain boats, especially if it was your dad's boat and you have first hand knowledge and lots of man hours invested.
The two boats are about as far apart performance wise as you can get, a 8 knot trawler and a potentially 40 knot sport fish.
The black iron fuel tanks are better off in someone's cellar where the speedy dry can absorb the leaking oil, the Defever bean counters trying to same money as usual. I have never seen such a bad deck construction on a boat. One of the Defever's I surveyed had teak decks that were screwed into the balsa core with no sealant, just the bungs that covered the #10 slotted bronze screws, not even Phillips head screws, rot everywhere, I think this boat had had the decking either heavily sanded or someone had replaced them very poorly. The side rails (wood cap rails with gates) were fastened with screws not thru bolts and were not a safe design from the start.
The peg board bulkhead dividers are another piece of poor thinking, they absorb water like a cheap sponge. One last item I did not like were the layout and placement of the copper fuel and return lines, shut off valves were very flimsy and were easily crushed from stepping on them or dented by the batteries being dropped on them, causing a restriction in the fuel flow.

The over all lay out of the Defever is very user friendly and there is lots of sleeping arrangements, storage lockers, cabinet and drawer space, which were seriously lacking on the 31. The sight lines from the bridge were good and hardware is good quality chrome bronze similar to the 31 Bertram. And it has a classic yacht look not like the new oval window Clorox bottle designs that flood todays market place. Enjoy you dad's old boat it will keep you busy for many more years.
Merry Christmas
Pete Fallon

[Catalina31]

Giff,
What a great boat the Defever 41s are, congrats! We have had our 1983 Defever 41 since 2000. Still have the original teak decks and have definitely spent some time re plugging and re cocking over the years. Enjoy the new project!
-Brian
(Had both boats out last weekend)

[gplume]

Your pix are a trip down memory lane for me. I used to hook up with my parents a couple times a summer, usually to or from a Bertram rendevous.Dad is the on the aft cabin in the last picture.
Looks like we were not the only B-31/Defever 41 family.

[Catalina31]

Giff,
Good looking combo! Interesting the subtle differences between the boats, what year is Patriot? I wonder what the reasoning was behind switching the stern boarding steps sides.

How bad is your deck and where? Our family enjoyed the first 41 so much we bought a second one that we kept in San Francisco, just sold her when we got the 31 this year. The other D41 was a 1981. The spot where I had deck issues on her was around the forward set of aft deck drains. They are in a different position from the 82. The issue was the water would accumulate and stay there, became a little spongy over time but never got around to addressing it. Prior to buying that boat in 2007 the teak decks on the fly bridge and "dinghy deck" had been removed and glassed over, so that boat most likely had problems on those decks in the past.

Wish you the best of luck with Patriot! Enjoy that roominess and fuel efficiency!