Cutting plaster. Is there a better way?

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Apr 30th, '12, 08:25

As we remodel the house I have from time to time had to cut through the plaster. The house is from the 20s and has 1" plaster which is more like a concrete slab with wire lath behind.

In opening up the stairwell I used a masonry blade on a circural saw to get a clean cut on the plaster set shallow as to leave a clean edge went back with a saws all to cut the remaining plaster and wire. It worked very well but created a huge cloud of dust that wasn't contained by the plastic I put up.

I has done another wall with a hammer and a wire cutter didn't need a clean edge on that one.

I am going to have to notch out the plaster to extend the stair treads and riser. The stairs were closed in by a wall. Any way to get a clean cut without the mess.

ianupton · Post by **ianupton** » Apr 30th, '12, 08:31

Sawsall will be cleaner cutting than the hammer and not nearly as much dust as circular saw.

If you have help, have someone hold shop vac hose right by blade, should collect most at the source.

Ian.

CaptPatrick · Post by **CaptPatrick** » Apr 30th, '12, 08:41

Hook a shop vac to your circular saw exhaust tube. Buy enough vacuum hose to allow you to set the vacuum outside or in an isolated area. The stock filter on the vacuum isn't going to contain all of the dust, for better containment you'd need a hepafilter...

For other tools without an exhaust tube tape the vacuum hose to the tool as close to the blade as possible or have a helper to aim the hose.

In Memory of Vicroy · Post by **In Memory of Vicroy** » Apr 30th, '12, 08:49

Hire illegals and pay them in cash to do it at night.

UV, the ever helpful

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Apr 30th, '12, 09:18

My next project is to notch out the wall to allow the stair treads to extend past the wall, the stairs were contained inside the wall originally. I'll be making many cuts 8-10" long and it's a rough plaster finish, would it make sense to use a grinder or something smaller to make these tighter cuts?

The nice thing about the masonry blade is I have a nice clean cut and it's just to difficult to patch up the rough finished plaster.

randall · Post by **randall** » Apr 30th, '12, 09:53

get a wet saw with a diamond blade and wet the plaster......clean as a whistle and no dust. just a thought.

Ironman · Post by **Ironman** » Apr 30th, '12, 09:56

use a 4" makita for tight radius.. & dribble a bit of water from a sponge to keep moist a shopvac helps too
Wayne

Mikey · Post by **Mikey** » Apr 30th, '12, 09:58

Peter,
Been doing this work for nearly fifty years. There is no easy way. The important thing is not how you cut through the plaster as it is always a mess. The important thing is a respirator for you! Not a dust mask, those are useless as . . ., well, useless. If you want to survive use a respirator and the biggest exhaust fan exiting the windows in the room where the work is. If the house has a forced air HVAC, shut it off, don't want that stuff in your system. There is no duct cleaning that will restore your system to pre-cutting condition. Next tape all adjoining doors to the room(s) where the work is being conducted. It won't keep it all out but consider what it would look like in the rest of the house had you not done it.
Last item, follow Uncle Vic's advice.
Rough plaster can be patched successfully to look original. Hire an old timer who has done it.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Apr 30th, '12, 11:54

Mikey

Haven't found a good plaster guy yet. Brick house, slate roof, steel casement windows. The house has outlived most tradesman. 3 houses on the block with a slate roof so we have good guy. Only one other house that has the original steel casement windows, when we had them repaired the crew travelled 300 miles and I had to put them up in a hotel overnight.

I'll find a pic of the plaster pretty cool look to it.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Apr 30th, '12, 12:32

Here is the wall in question I think you can make out the plaster finish. This is an old pic the back stair wall was removed when we redid the kitchen.

If anyone knows the technique used to get that finish I would be very interested as it's throughout the entire house..More for curiousity then to replicate...

Rawleigh · Post by **Rawleigh** » Apr 30th, '12, 12:35

I used a carbide tipped sawsall blade when I did mine. I haven't seen them for sale since then though.

Edit: Here are some from Amazon!

http://www.amazon.com/Freud-DS0906CW-Di ... B004OEGJUS

In Memory Walter K · Post by **In Memory Walter K** » Apr 30th, '12, 14:10

Yours is an old house and they don't make them that way any more. Had one like it in Nassau County. I found the wall behind a radiator was cracked a bit and didn't feel solid. When I started looking for solid wall, I ended up with a 6' x 9' hole and a huge pile of rubble. There was wood lathe covered by wire lath covered by grey scrim cement under the textured plaster surface. You CAN probably fix it easier than find a "plasterer" that can. You just have to be patient and let the under layers dry well before putting anything over them. The grey "scrim" cement will go through the wire lath and also probably the wood lath. If it's a patch, leave room for the plaster coat which you will texture. In my case, I had a texture I had to try and match. If it's a whole wall, you have more flexibility. I was advised to let the grey coat dry for at least a week. There are new materials you can probably work with that will work better than Plaster of Paris which sometimes dries too quickly and can leave hairline cracks. Good quality joint cement comes to mind. I remember experimenting with a wet sponge and a crumpled wet rag to ascertain what gives you the texture you like.
If you ever call in anyone to estimate a new kitchen or bathroom, BEWARE! I came home to find they put a sledgehammer to the walls right down to the outer brick. Framed it with 2 x 4's, wallboarded, taped and spackled it, and were ready to paint by 4 pm. TAKE NOTHING FOR GRANTED! Craftsmen are hard to find and most are retired.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Apr 30th, '12, 14:58

Luckily Walter the larger work is done. Had a wall AC unit that we pulled out, had to patch the brick work outside and a nice size hole in the dining room wall. I haven't gotten the hang of plaster of paris. We couldn't get it on the wall fast enough before it dried. I faked the finish and it came out ok but I still notice it everyday. Other sections of the house I've had to pulll down a poorly done repair jobs and try to match it up. I've used a paint stick and a putty knife to try and replicate the finish. Hopefully most of that is done, most contractors solution is to cover the entire wall with 1/4" sheetrock, I've kicked more then a few out of the house. The only option is to be my own contractor and find a few tradesman I can trust.

In remodeling the kitchen we were able to save all the original plaster, in the living room a beautiful arch was removed (not sure what the previous owner was thinking) had to pull down his sheetrock job. The original wood trim on the exterior was covered in siding. Not only have we had to restore the original work but also undo really poor work of previous owners.

I'm very proud that the large majority of the first floor has original plaster walls, ceiling and wood floor. Original moldings and windows. 95% of the electric and plumbing is new. Heat and AC system and ducts are new. Even have a skeleton key in the front door, tryed to restore the door but it's pretty bowed, cracked and beat up, it needs replacing but I chalk it up to old world charm.

The second floor when I'm done, hopefully before the baby arrives, will have molding and trim that very closely resemble the original style on the first floor.

There are 5 other houses in my neighborhood that are very similar to mine but all are just slightly different. Some have ignored the original character and others give great respect to the original detail. It's just like this sandbox but much smaller. Just way harder to find parts like matching door hardware, base cap moulding and window latches.

Tony Meola · Post by **Tony Meola** » Apr 30th, '12, 21:50

Peter

You can get a plaster look with joint compound. Just don't use the light stuff. After using regular joint compound, for what ever reason I picked up the light stuff to skim coat a bathroom wall. What a mistake. Stuff is too soft and damages too easily.

Get a piece of plywood or old piece of sheet rock and practive trying to get the look you want.

By the time you are done with this project the work on the boat will look like childs play.

White Bear · Post by **White Bear** » May 1st, '12, 06:08

Sounds just like a house I had in Garden City. The entire area was developed by the Mott Brothers in the late '30s. Mine had a brick and stucco exterior, steel casement windows, slate roof and aluminum warren trusses supporting the first floor. I understand the warren trusses were an extra cost option for buyers who ordered it. Remodeling was always a chore due to the strength of the original construction.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » May 1st, '12, 07:47

Peter you are around the block from Jeanette and Chris . There house is built 1908 so grandpa whet over and level the 1st floor with steel beams. Then my son in law remove walls only in one room at a time because ceiling have beautiful plaster molding multiple steps with Victoria design in relief.best method he found was not to cut and make dust around children, I taught him a different method that is to make hole with hammer then insert crowbar and rip sections out like two or three feet at a time.you know he is a vice president in advertising firm yet he was determine to learn how to restore that plaster on ceiling ?intricate designs with pieces missing he totally restore with plaster and wall compound mix together.looks great when going by take a look .rounded arches are also restore ,then he put drywall on walls and taped to match. I did my den in that country French look that you pictured ,like tony said practice first then go for it .i used regular taping compound and a bricklayer pointed trowel . I then put two coats of paint and it looks great .i can post picture if you like.my wife is a interior decorator and extreme perfectionist the kid come come to her for advice and that's we're that idea came from along with rag painting and foix painting

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » May 1st, '12, 08:13

Bob pictures would be great. I stop and chat all the time but haven't been in the house. Like me it sounds like something's always going on.

Here are few before and afters, still a long way to go.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » May 1st, '12, 08:24

i love it. been in contruction all my life was also my father`s business .needless to say "daddy i need help is a familiar sound" thank god only two children son never ask only stone or brick work. i took photo of den maybe you want a close up.?

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » May 1st, '12, 08:28

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » May 1st, '12, 08:28

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » May 1st, '12, 08:34

you can see the plaster design just to the right of window . i can take a close up if you need it but you will come up with your own design . just make sure you don`t ever pull trowel away because you will have 1970 era pointed effect ``````````not good.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » May 1st, '12, 08:35

Current project

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » May 1st, '12, 08:41

Nicely done bob. I'm trying match existing not create a new design. My great uncle was a plasterer his skills were never passed down.

ianupton · Post by **ianupton** » May 1st, '12, 08:43

Peter - I love the young worker program.

Here's mine:

This was almost two years ago and my now 7 year old remembers it like it was yesterday.

I also think that I have the same couch that you showed in one of those pictures.

Ian.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » May 1st, '12, 09:05

That's the best way to teach the young one 's ,hands on while they are young instead of video games. Even if there destine to be a surgeon still great to be handy around house.peter love the shower tumble marble never goes out of style great product to work with.my wife has a good eye for the finish look so I just do as she says then I can jump out of planes,drive race boats and hunt bear she never says a word.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » May 1st, '12, 09:09

Ian. Carter loves the tools. We spend an hour last night sitting in the work zone. What's this? Why? You know the drill. The couch went out last week ten years of stained service.

The upstairs was 2 bedrooms a play area and a half bath that was as tight as the Bertram. It's now gonna be 2 beds, full bath with hallway with 15 feet of closets. Kids zone.

Baby is due Aug 10. Got to finish construction, furnish a bedroom and transition my son to a big boy room. Like Bob I love doing it but bit off a bit to much with the boats and yard, with a wife who is 6 months along. Fishing time not happening yet.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » May 1st, '12, 09:39

bob lico wrote:That's the best way to teach the young one 's ,hands on while they are young instead of video games. Even if there destine to be a surgeon still great to be handy around house.peter love the shower tumble marble never goes out of style great product to work with.my wife has a good eye for the finish look so I just do as she says then I can jump out of planes,drive race boats and hunt bear she never says a word.

Similar deal, I have more input on the design and less finishing skills, but I do enough work that I am "allowed" what I want which is basically to go fishing at the drop of a hat.

BTW I designed the kitchen cabinet layout, a friend of mine built the cabinets in my garage and we painted with a brush. We made it fit without disturbing the plaster, or moving windows which is a big headache with the brick exterior.

Losing the play space up stairs means next up is finishing the basement. Already moved ducts, plumbing added sub floor and majority of framing. That will sit until after the new baby and fishing season.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » May 1st, '12, 09:56

Jeanette has the same style kitchen with board and bead on walls and the original 1908 southern pine floor restored with antique marble island in center.i love that turn of the century look as well as everybody in family.anthony is restoring a turn of the century English Tudor in south Sayville.like myself no trademan has ever set foot in the house except aliens cutting the lawn.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » May 1st, '12, 10:09

Our pine floor in the kitchen is new. The old floor was beyond repair. I called in a tile guy for the marble to expensive for me to screw up.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » May 1st, '12, 10:42

my wife gave me a real tough one a few years back. she wanted glass block across top of shower and across adjoining bathroom so i had to raise roof and put in gable roof and steel truss to span glass block. then went on to marble floor and walls . tub is cast iron hot tub around 400 lbs up a flight of stairs almost killed me . prject took a year . sometimes you have to sit back and weight your options
before getting into a project to deep well she wanted bright bathroom she got all three of them with skylights. on the subject consult me on the skylight most people have leaks sooner or later there is not one nail in any of the skylights.

u

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » May 1st, '12, 10:59

I'd love to put a skylight in the stairwell, with the slate roof that's 90 years old without a leak. Plus $20 per tile for replacement has made me put off the idea to a later date. I don't know anybody personally that has a slate roof and added a skylight, obviously it's been done. It's an easy cut in from the interior so doesn't hold up my work...

Mikey · Post by **Mikey** » May 1st, '12, 20:57

the enemy of any slate roof is a qualified repair person. If it ain't broke . . .
My brother read articles in Fine Homebuilding acquired the tools and repaired his own roof. He says it is a lot easier than it is touted to be.

Tony Meola · Post by **Tony Meola** » May 1st, '12, 21:34

Peter

Let me say this, you have nothing to be ashmed of when it comes to the work you are doing. What you have done to the house looks pretty good to me.

Your problem is that that house is eating into fishing. My problem is that my job is eating into work on the house and the fishing. I would have the house eating into the fishing than the job.

Stay with it and like Bob says, keep at the plastering. You will get the hang of it.

Capt.Frank · Post by **Capt.Frank** » May 2nd, '12, 00:02

Peter very nice work. The gridle on you stove is that cast iron? if so what are the measurments? and any clue where you got it from? I have the same stove and have been looking for a 14" X 26" I think gridle for it.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » May 2nd, '12, 06:22

Frank it's 12x24 aluminum with a non stick surface, I don't think they make a cast iron one.

http://www.vikingrange.com/consumer/pro ... t-overview

Rawleigh · Post by **Rawleigh** » May 2nd, '12, 07:57

Mikey wrote:the enemy of any slate roof is a qualified repair person. If it ain't broke . . .
My brother read articles in Fine Homebuilding acquired the tools and repaired his own roof. He says it is a lot easier than it is touted to be.

Mikey: Flattened copper pipe is the trick for replacing slates.

MarkS · Post by **MarkS** » May 2nd, '12, 13:22

Peter,
if you are looking to add light to the stairway and don't care what is happening outside (like hows the weather) these skylight tubes are awesome! I put one in the hall bath which had no window. The bride keeps reaching in the door to shut the light off, it's not on it's the light tube.

http://www.o.biz/Home-Garden/ODL-10-inc ... 3000599623

I like it a lot!

Tile work looks nice in the bath. We build tons of ceramic, stone, marble and granite showers every year. If you have any questions or concerns feel free to ask. I fix a lot of failed ones too. Water is lazy and finds the quickest way to make your life a total disaster. Safing safing safing proper pitch and a high quality drain with pan liner to the weep holes is a must.

Capt.Frank · Post by **Capt.Frank** » May 2nd, '12, 19:42

Thanks Peter. 12 x 24 is right. Keep up the good work almost done.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » May 2nd, '12, 21:20

Peter in retrospect while I was sweating it out putting down that marble floor you were fly casting for bass on the flats!!!!so who is the real dummy here I still have no clue on the use of a fly rod and the ability to work with marble and glassblock is meaningless .This year I will step up to the lite rod with avet reel my first attemp at this kind of bass fishing.

Ed Curry · Post by **Ed Curry** » May 3rd, '12, 00:05

I spent the first ten years of my mortgage building my castle and it pleased me. I've been spending the past ten years playing on the bay and letting the homestead decline, and it pleased me more. I still can't catch a fish to save my life but maybe thats what the next ten years are for.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » May 3rd, '12, 07:30

Ed that is what I am saying.we have brothers like Charlie out of Freeport whom is a pro at live lining while I try and try with little success .he put in the time in his early years while I built my museum piece just stupid . I also missed so good hunting years looking back.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » May 3rd, '12, 08:08

It's all a trade off. I bought an old beat up boat after graduating college, before that I was a surf fisherman. I was able to fish before work 3 days a week and any time day or night. I was 36 when my son was born, that was about 14 years of free time. I don't claim to be a great fisherman but I've befriended and learned from many who are.

Now I have to prioritize, Raybo working on the boat, DIY on many aspects of the house. Saving money so my wife can stay home for six months with the new baby. Balance my own fishing addiction with spending with the family.

I am truely the master of none and mostly ok with that.

Charlie J · Post by **Charlie J** » May 3rd, '12, 08:12

as they say peter one day at a time

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » May 3rd, '12, 08:22

Peter what I missed while building everything including cars ( that's another story) what proper procedure and the tricks you guys do. Take for example live lining .i finds school then snag a few bunker and try my luck.i take a pro like Phil from our marina who was born on west island and he says what are doing!!!!! Wrong!!!! Here is the way and he proceed to cast into the center of the pod. And drag the bunker just a little it imitate a fish in distress but he keeps the lead trible hook in the fish and never takes it in. Bam there is a huge bass coming in while i dick a round with just over legs l size.it is this little edge as well as these little coves he fishes in that nobody knows.that comes with putting in your time not installing granite backsplash in the kitchen.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » May 3rd, '12, 08:44

Fishing is a great sport all you need is an open mind an a willingness to learn. At the same time you give back what you learn to others.

We had a 38lb in the inlet this fall as you know, I was super psyched. That week everyone was fishing the ocean and catching smaller fish. I marked bait on the Foruno Ed donated to me. Brew passed along a short comment prior. While everyone else drags a diamond jig through the water column he drags a buck tail on the bottom for the big lazy fish. We tried it and it worked.

It may not work again for a long time but now everyone on this board has another trick up their sleeve.

bertram31.com

Cutting plaster. Is there a better way?

Cutting plaster. Is there a better way?

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