Davit

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Jan 11th, '11, 14:33

With the incoming snow storm there is nothing to do but day dream about the warm weather to come.

One thing I like to think I will be able to do with the boat is take it for extended weekends with a small flats boat in tow and use the B31 as a mother ship.

There are a few micro skiffs out there

www.venganzamarine.com or www.hellsbayboatworks.com

Both are 13' and weigh around 250lbs plus 6 gallons of fuel and a 15hp approximate. 115lbs.

Are removable davits an option? Or do I need to tow it behind the boat. I've also seen guys pull it over the transom and place a cradle where a fighting chair would be.

Not sure if this is a good idea or not but thought I'd solicit some opinions. More realistically I will probably want some sort of dingy or kayak for anchoring over at the beach this summer.

Pete

Charlie J · Post by **Charlie J** » Jan 11th, '11, 14:44

pete
i would just tow it, its a short run across the gsb

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Jan 11th, '11, 14:50

I've got a 20' flats boat for the GSB. I am more thinking if I want to go to moriches, shinnecock or gardiners.

CaptPatrick · Post by **CaptPatrick** » Jan 11th, '11, 14:59

Second the towing... Also see: http://bertram31.com/newbb/viewtopic.php?p=60725

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Jan 11th, '11, 15:11

I guess the removable davit is a bad idea?

St croix marine products makes a removable transom davit that is rated up to 500 lbs. When properly installed. The idea behind a 13' boat that is really light may make this feasible.

Thanks for the link capt I read that thread a while back. That would work with my current boat just going across the bay but if I ever decided to go out to montauk and then across to nantuket that is a long trip and potentially rough weather to be concerned with having a boat in tow.

STraenkle · Post by **STraenkle** » Jan 11th, '11, 15:39

That was a good thread on towing, but favorite was the one about the guy who forgot to tow the boat pointy end first and sunk his dingy.

Also towing a very light boat can send it flying over even small waves at cruise speed.

Brewster Minton · Post by **Brewster Minton** » Jan 11th, '11, 16:31

Peter, if you " go to moriches, shinnecock or gardiners" you call me and Ill take you in my flats boat or you can use the boat if Im offshore.

CaptPatrick · Post by **CaptPatrick** » Jan 11th, '11, 16:53

The davit strength is one thing, but the strength of it's attachment substructure is quite another issue.

Cantilevering 400# on a live seaway could easily generate a live load of a thousand pounds or more. Kinda' gets back to the tailgate issue of re-engineering the transom...

randall · Post by **randall** » Jan 11th, '11, 16:56

i throw my 16 foot kayak in the bertram all the time. and its a 25. i've kayaked all over gardiners bay the easy way. in a 31 its a piece of cake.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Jan 11th, '11, 19:02

Ok Capt Pat. I am convinced a davit system won't work, I will drop those thoughts.

Now if I had the tailgate I could just drag that little boat into the cockpit.

Or as Randall mentions I could probably drag that boat over the transom into the boat with a little help.

In Memory Walter K · Post by **In Memory Walter K** » Jan 11th, '11, 19:36

A couple of those long foam "noodles" they sell as pool flotations could act as transom rollers to help get a light 13 footer into your cockpit without marring your stern. Just a thought. Two man job I would guess.

randall · Post by **randall** » Jan 11th, '11, 19:59

its pretty easy to tow an inflatable.

jspiezio · Post by **jspiezio** » Jan 11th, '11, 20:02

PeterPalmieri wrote:Ok Capt Pat. I am convinced a davit system won't work, I will drop those thoughts.

Now if I had the tailgate I could just drag that little boat into the cockpit.

Or as Randall mentions I could probably drag that boat over the transom into the boat with a little help.

A very solid swim platform might serve you better with a micro dinghy. i know folks who bring the outboard of the dinghy into the boat. Then they lay the dinghy gunwale down on the swim platform and cockpit leaning against the transom. This keeps the weight down, and in close to the transom to minimize the leverage and the moment. It also has the weight on a very strong structure that tranmits the forcr to the lowest and strongest parts of the transom, rather than up high and into the gunwales like a davit system. Just an idea that looks sort of like this:

coolair · Post by **coolair** » Jan 11th, '11, 23:58

dumb question maybe i missed this but what about on the bow like some of the big boats

CaptPatrick · Post by **CaptPatrick** » Jan 12th, '11, 04:16

"Cause a B31 ain't a big boat...

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Jan 12th, '11, 11:17

Anybody have thought on the tip up design on a swim platform?

SteveM · Post by **SteveM** » Jan 12th, '11, 11:58

the tip up design sounds like it could be your ticket, I'd be interested to see what you find out. maybe an 11' or 9' boston whaler? or inflatable.

Rawleigh · Post by **Rawleigh** » Jan 12th, '11, 12:05

How about an articulated solid tow bar from each side of the transom of the Bertram to a fixed point on the bow of the towed boat to make the boat tow straight and close to the transom? Has anyone tried this? Is it a dumb idea? The boat could go up and down, but not side to side. It would tow right on the backside of the haystack. Just a thought.

John F. · Post by **John F.** » Jan 12th, '11, 12:43

Pete-

I'd go take a look at the transom on your B31--the transom on mine wasn't substantial. B31s work great for what they were designed to do, and I don't think that they were designed or built to have a transom door, fold-down transom, or a hundreds of pounds of boat hanging off the stern on a davit or on a swim platform. B31s as built will always get you home. My guess is that you'll have to do alot of reengineering to make it happen without compromising the boat. I think Randall's kayak in the cockpit is a pretty good ideas. I had an 11' whaler for a few years for the kids--it was light, but not so light I'd hang it off the transom. My 2 cents.

John

Tony Meola · Post by **Tony Meola** » Jan 12th, '11, 21:35

Pete

Giff has a current thread with pictures of his. Pretty cool.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Jan 13th, '11, 09:30

Can someone tell me the dimensions of the cockpit? Specifically the length from the back of the engine box to the transom? And from the transom to the cabin bulkhead.

If I do get a kayak I'd like to know how different lengths will fit in the boat.

randall · Post by **randall** » Jan 13th, '11, 09:44

any length will fit. you put it on one engine box with the rest over the transom. i guess a really small one would actually fit in the cockpit. 25's are like sport fishers with no rear cabin bulkhead so i slide mine across the dinette table and let it hang over the stern. i just use towels and bungee cords. the next step is to figure out how to get in and out of it. not really that hard but takes a little thought.

as long as we are on the subject....kayaks come in two types...sit in and sit on. i have both but much prefer the sit in. length equals speed. if it was warm water, boat only, i would get a small sit on.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Jan 13th, '11, 11:00

Thanks Randall! You are the official site kayak expert.

I have a long list of toys and needs for the boat so I am a little bit all over the map.

Firstly I need something so I can drop my wife and son at the dock at various fire island beaches. I'll then go and anchor the boat 500 yards out and paddle in. A simple sit on top kayak works for that.

Well since nothing is simple I am thinking why not have something that I can have fun using, why not have something I can fish from and why not have something with a motor.

So my first thought was one of those 12'9 micro skiffs at 250 lbs I still think I may be able to pull off the motor and drag it over the transom like you suggested with a kayak.

There is also a very cool kayak.

Www.dragonflyboatworksllc.com

They have a 12' stand up kayak that can be used for fly fishing, that would be a fun toy as well.

Just some crazy ideas for summer toys.

CaptPatrick · Post by **CaptPatrick** » Jan 13th, '11, 11:21

The 12' Flyfisher w/ the trolling motor option would cover all of your bets...

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Jan 13th, '11, 11:21

Check out this photo

This is a 17' or 18' boat on back of a 30 that has been designed to do this.

Be it a kayak or one of these ultra light 13' skiffs or a dinghy. I thought I may be able to build a support system using the fighting chair post and a removable roller on the transom.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Jan 13th, '11, 11:33

CaptPatrick wrote:The 12' Flyfisher w/ the trolling motor option would cover all of your bets...

That's a very cool little setup, with the trolling motor it's 100lbs without it's 90lbs.

The pricing is $3200 with the trolling motors $2200 without.

randall · Post by **randall** » Jan 13th, '11, 12:33

peter...i wouldnt want to be in any kind of weather with that system. the inflateable is so popular because it is an unsinkable giant fender. very versatile and you can fish and carry a bunch of people. mine (the one mike's friend amy left at my house two years ago for the winter) has a johnson 15 and is scary fast to boot.

a ten foot sit on kayak fits easily in the cockpit and is fun to fish from. but it wont keep you dry when the weather is cold.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Jan 13th, '11, 12:59

Randall,

I'm not worried about cold weather and water. I'm only concerned with June-Sept. beach days and summer fun. What do you think of the fly fishing kayak.

I haven't considered an inflateble but I guess I should.

Pete

STraenkle · Post by **STraenkle** » Jan 13th, '11, 13:07

I have one of those cheap west marine inflatables with a 4Hp on the back. Just tie one end to the inside of the swim platform, put the outboard in the cockpit and tilt up on the swim platorm. Like the picture earlier. Takes 5 Mins by myself and the inflatables weighs next to nothing. Used it to ferry people to the beach when we achored. It would hold 4 people, not fast with a 4 HP but you wouldn't have to use any fenders or anything. It was also get as a tender if on the hook.

randall · Post by **randall** » Jan 13th, '11, 15:56

peter...it wouldnt work for me at all. way to heavy. i live 3 minutes from the water...lots of different water ..and throw the kayak on the truck and go. when i put it in the bertram i generally do everything myself. the little pop out sit ons you can get for a few hundred bucks actually make more sense to me as a boat tender..fishing platform. the 90 lb flyfisher makes more sense if you can leave it in the water or on the beach. yanking it into a boat...no thanks.

In Memory Walter K · Post by **In Memory Walter K** » Jan 13th, '11, 16:28

Peter- If you're planning to go to the Somerset fly fishing show, I'm sure you will see some stuff there that will give you more to think about, with the added advantage of seeing and feeling the merchandise. It's always been a long run for me to do alone in one day. What time in the AM do you leave Babylon to go there? Walter

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Jan 13th, '11, 16:36

Randall,

We are definitely talking different water. Tons of sand flats and marsh land in my neck of the woods. Very little need for a shallow draft in open waters

If I could get permission to keep that 13' boat next to my boat I would consider towing it. The fiberglass kayak would be perfect for the kind of fishing I like to do and would get me from the boat to beach easily when anchored. I am concerned with the weight, both putting it on top of the car and dragging it into the boat. A sit on top ocean kayak is an easy solution, it wouldn't get much fishing use but I could ride some waves while I'm at the beach.

A zodiac is a convenient tender but not much use from a fun on the water stand point. I could also just use my surf board and paddle in.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Jan 13th, '11, 16:41

walterk wrote:Peter- If you're planning to go to the Somerset fly fishing show, I'm sure you will see some stuff there that will give you more to think about, with the added advantage of seeing and feeling the merchandise. It's always been a long run for me to do alone in one day. What time in the AM do you leave Babylon to go there? Walter

Walter I am really looking forward to somerset. I believe a friend is driving with me and he has to drop his son off at the bus before we can leave. I am guessing we won't leave until at least 8am. If you want to come along I can get a better idea of the time.

It should be an interesting drive my buddy is a marine biologist and a pretty interesting guy. There are another 5 or 6 friends that well be meeting there for lunch.

randall · Post by **randall** » Jan 13th, '11, 18:07

peter...ive paddled in and out on my surf board many many times. only a viable option if you are going surfing or its really hot out. somewhat scary at night in a crowded anchorage. you can always emulate walter and get a skiff for the flats, a bertram 20 for the bay and use the 31 in the ocean.

theres a reason inflateables are so popular.

Davit

Davit

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