fire suppression

Marlin · Post by **Marlin** » Dec 6th, '10, 05:16

looking for feedback on what 2 do with my b31 with new diesels, I have an auto?manual fireoy system in my other boat that shuts the engines down and closes the dorade boxes shutters, what has been the experience with this informed group of b31 ers

Pete Fallon · Post by **Pete Fallon** » Dec 7th, '10, 00:34

Marlin,
I would go with the small Halon FE 241 bottles, one for each engine box. You can get a remote operation head control for up on the fly bridge and wire it to each bottle. The units have a fusable link head, rate of rise, I think their set to go off around 170-190 degrees. The old Halon 1301 units are not available anymore, the new stuff doesn't kill you, the old Halon 1301 uses up all the oxygen in the area and they found that if someone was in a confined area when it went off it would knock you out very quickly and might even kill you.

They also make a dry chemical unit with separate bottles, but dry chems make a real mess when they are discharged.

Just make sure you get the right size for the area, if the bottles are just borderline I would go to the next size up. Better to be over than to run out of agent and have a re-ignition.
Pete Fallon

Marlin · Post by **Marlin** » Dec 7th, '10, 08:21

Peter thx, helpful info, I was sure someone in this group had some experience

Dug · Post by **Dug** » Dec 7th, '10, 08:45

Pete, my only fear is that if a diesel inhales that stuff (not Halon) I have heard it will kill the engine. Not shut it down, but kill it.

I have been afraid to re-mount due to the risk of an accidental discharge.

What do you think?

In Memory of Vicroy · Post by **In Memory of Vicroy** » Dec 7th, '10, 09:40

I view any system that shuts the motors off without my input to be a potential death trap.....watch out for that 998 foot tanker coming down the river......ouch....gimme a loud ass alarm, but let me decide whether to shut 'em down or not.

UV

IRGuy · Post by **IRGuy** » Dec 7th, '10, 10:37

I strongly agree with UV.. you never know what situation you would be in when your systems discharges, and you might need to get out of the main channel or beach your boat after a fire starts, if there really is one. The only thing that shuts your engine down should be you! Plus safety systems, just like other systems, can and do fail. My son-in-law landed his FA-18 on the deck of a carrier on one engine (not usually done on a single engine) after a safety system signaled the other engine had a problem and per SOP he shut it down. The post mortem showed the engine was fine, but had a faulty sensor in the safety system.

CaptPatrick · Post by **CaptPatrick** » Dec 7th, '10, 13:01

The fire system auto shut down is a double edged sword...

I personally know of one 50' Choy Lee, (baby brother to Pee Wee Reese's old boat), that burned to the water line in the Florida ICW. Owner, by himself, was taking the boat for a brief spin just to exercise the engines.

On his way back to the marina, he gets a loud warning buzzer that indicates a fire. He climbs off the bridge to check and can't find any fire or smell smoke. 'Course he didn't go all the way into the engine room, just looked through the companionway into the engine room. Engines are still running and the monster fire bottle didn't have a auto shut down...

On his way back up to the bridge, he notices that the exhaust is smoking a funny grey color, but shrugs it off. Needless to say, those two big Man diesels made short work of the supressant...

He shuts off the alarm, puts the boat back into gear, and continues on to the marina.

a brief few minutes later he notices smoke coming from the open engine room hatch. Again goes to check.

Engine room is lit up like a coal furnace. He opens the cabin door and the whole cabin is a blaze.

He rushes back up to the bridge and radios in a May Day, but by that time the fire is breaking through the cabin overhead and the bridge is filling with smoke.

He gets back down to the cockpit fast but has no where else to go and can't swim so he's stuck on the boat.

A USCG RIB equipped with a fire cannon comes barreling up and gets him transferred to their vessel, while setting up to fight the fire.

Long story short, the boat burnt to the water line, Coasties managed to keep the fire restricted and out of the cockpit and fuel tank.

So, which side of the gamble do you take? The odds of both a fire and a hazardous navigation situation happening at the same time are by far greater than either one singularly...

I play the odds. If I have an engine space fire system, I want auto shut down.

In Memory of Vicroy · Post by **In Memory of Vicroy** » Dec 7th, '10, 13:48

Maybe on a big boat with an enclosed engine room, but not on a B31 would be my view.

And......learn to swim.....

UV

wmachovina · Post by **wmachovina** » Dec 7th, '10, 13:57

Vic- the beauty of the 31 is 2,Two, engine compartments.if one autoshuts down the other should keep going long enough to avoid that tanker,and if both go-bail- not your day

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Dec 7th, '10, 13:58

From what ive read away from this site and i am by no means an expert on this topic.

With out the engines shutting down the fire supresent is quickly sucked out the exhaust and will not put out any fire. Which leads me to think that without the engine shutdown the extinguishers may be useless.

I am contemplating what i should do with my boat as well since the current halons need replacing.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Dec 7th, '10, 14:01

wmachovina wrote:Vic- the beauty of the 31 is 2,Two, engine compartments.if one autoshuts down the other should keep going long enough to avoid that tanker,and if both go-bail- not your day

I could be totally off base but in reading most systems shut down both engines regardless of which extinguisher goes off. At least that was my understanding from reading on the fire boy site.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Dec 7th, '10, 14:03

At least with the fireboy shutdown i read about they also had an engine restart override switch. Not sure if that is all models or standard across other brands.

Bruce · Post by **Bruce** » Dec 7th, '10, 14:27

If you go with one stystem for both engine boxes, the cheaper way, it will shut down both engines.

The way around that is to buy two systems, one for each box.

Of course one engine won't mean crap unless you have oversize rudders.

wmachovina · Post by **wmachovina** » Dec 7th, '10, 15:27

Bruce,you could go in circles entering the smokescreen so the tanker wont see you when he hits, or he may try to avoid the ring of fire.

Dug · Post by **Dug** » Dec 7th, '10, 15:58

Bruce, will the non-halon suppressant kill a diesel? As in ruin it?

IRGuy · Post by **IRGuy** » Dec 7th, '10, 19:50

Re: Capt Pat's post above.. I always wear a life preserver if I am operating any boat alone. Alone, if you fall overboard there is a good chance that your boat would keep on going and not many of us can swim at 6 knots plus.

Pete Fallon · Post by **Pete Fallon** » Dec 8th, '10, 13:00

Guy's
As a former professional fire fighter- EMT I would rather have the engines shut down than burn to death or burn up the boat. I have had many burns over the years and it is the most painful injury going.
The discussion on which type of unit to buy is like a rectum, everyone has got at least one.
In the 32 years I've owned my boat I have never had an issue or a fire with the fire suppression units I've got. (2- Old Halon 1301 Units with out remote activation, just the fusable link heads.). I weigh the units every year just to see if they still have agent inside and make sure that the heads are clean. You can have the most complex and expensive system or just a simple one like mine, but make sure you have something in place.

If you don't already know, the installation of CO units in any vessel with a cabin is now manditory in new boats and makes a lot of sense when restoring an old boat. The units are cheap and can be found at any big box store. More insurance companies are also asking if there are smoke detectors on my surveyed vessels. They make a combo unit smoke &CO that is battery operated and easy to install. Just one more small thing that could save a life and reduce your insurance premimuim.
Pete Fallon

Tony Meola · Post by **Tony Meola** » Dec 8th, '10, 21:45

Peter

I assume you are running gas engines if you don't have the auto shut off.

Does anyone have a fire alarm set up in the engine compartment and if you do what are you using?

Hopefully the fire alarm would go off before the Halon system and you could shut the engines down yourself. Just a thought.

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