Fishbox drain idea

[ktm_2000]

Hi All,

I was planning on running the hoses from my fishboxes inside the center stringer. I had purchased 90 degree turned deck drains from gemlux and didn't expect the flange to be as small as it is. The flange is maybe only 1/2" on the sides of the back tube. Drawing of idea https://photos.app.goo.gl/FDzobpgBzL7saH3Z7

There is no way I would be able to run any marine quality hose on the back side of that and be able to bend the hose through such a small opening and then screw the flange to the center stringer

pic for frame of reference - https://photos.app.goo.gl/Rcue9cR5vaupsX3r5


my idea is to cut out a circle piece of starboard 2-3x the size of needed then drill a hole towards the bottom edge to fit the deck drain in, I would then screw the deck drain to the starboard, install the hose, then screw both pieces into the stringer. quick drawing of idea https://photos.app.goo.gl/jnoec2N5HkH9SPub8

would this method be sound? any suggestions to do it better?

[CamB25]

Everything should drain aft. It looks like your holes are forward? It's tough. I gave up on trying to "manage" drains. Everything drains to the bilge and runs aft. If I ever get a chance to fish, they will go into a cooler.

Looking at your picture. How are you getting your fuel fills/vents to the tank? I don't see the curved part of the stringer in your picture - see my pic: https://www.amazon.com/photos/shared/rL ... eQS67pQ9Ap

[ktm_2000]

Cam,

My fishboxes are going to be just aft of the cabin bulkheads, then the battery boxes, then the fuel tank. The fuel fill U shaped notch is just aft of the battery box. here's an older pic showing more of it, the wooden piece will be the backer board under the deck to bolt the front of the doghouse center console to. https://photos.app.goo.gl/9eQeArzYmUjYmLAP8

I've toyed with the idea of putting a water tight plug in the back of the center stringer and a hose barb coming out of there but the idea of trying to clean out crap out of the insides of the stringer grids is not appealing to me thus my idea of putting hoses in to contain the mess.

[Yannis]

After all these pics, yours and Cam’s, I get the impression that the under the sole space in a 25 is very complicated...

[ktm_2000]

Yannis,

It really isn't, I'm really trying my hardest to make it complicated and should step back and use the KISS principle (Keep It Simple Stupid)

My issue is that I'm trying to use the inside of the hull bottom as a fishbox with no liner, it is giving me grief trying to get water out of there. If it were just straight water I wouldn't care but If I put fish down there with the corresponding blood, guts, scales and slime it is another story.

Here's a pic facing forward after 1 coat of finish paint, I'm standing where the fuel tank will go, What you see is the front half of the boat.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/fKw78JCYPCrdbR6GA

[Tony Meola]

So you are relying on the macerator to drain the box's. The bottom of the box is actually the hull correct?

I am not really familiar with how the 25 lays out. But thinking about this and I may be way off base but I will try and give you some food for thought.

I believe most box's drain at the lowest point, and using the hull as the bottom of the box does not allow for this. You would have to figure out if once in the water how the boat will sit. If the box sits a little bow down and you put the drain in the stern inside corner, then she will not totally drain and will drive you crazy.

[ktm_2000]

Tony,

Good point and I would expect that to occur. The last little bit would be a pain every time.

As an I/O, she was an A$$ dragger at rest so it wouldn't be an issue, getting up on plane would put the water backwards as well.

on the water at rest
https://photos.app.goo.gl/tPoUpz4XBPWfyozt8

[neil]

No drains in the fish boxes means no blood in the bildge

[ktm_2000]

That is my goal, no blood in the bilge. keep it in the fishboxes and have it go out the macerator pump.

I've got to get this whole setup together by early next week so I can put my fuel tank in and glass down my deck next weekend. I'll post pics as I go.

[PeterPalmieri]

I think what Neil is referring to is sticking with the KISS principal. No holes in the bottom of the box or hoses or pumps just a couple of handles so that it lifts out. Remove your catch, bucket out sloshing water and ice, lift out and dump over the side.

[ktm_2000]

I get it, to do what you suggest would require 2 pull out fishboxes and individual hatch openings on either side of the center stringer as traditionally done in the cockpit of a B31 or smaller fishbox inserts which go in to the one hatch I have.

On my boat I tried to make use drop down portion of the cockpit which would end up in front of the center console and thought I was making "simple" by re-using components which I had. The space I had was 66" long and 48" wide. I re-used a 1/2 of a fuel tank hatch from a 6cyl B25 which CMP gave me years ago and cut down and modified my old fuel tank hatch frame to match it. The drains I was planning to put in are just in front of the bulkhead and run hoses inside of the center stringer until they come out in the old motor well in the back of the boat where a macerator pump will be. If I keep the fish slime in those hoses, the bilge and the fishboxes should be separated from one another.

I realize that it is not the most ideal situation for many reasons, ice not lasting long is probably going to be the biggest reason but I don't need to keep catch cold for more than a 3/4 of a day and plan on keeping ice in coolers on the deck until used.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/a8bH8rxtWoyUabPu5

[neil]

Peter you got it ,we have two handles on the insisted of the boxes inlaid with oak ,it is really nice to not have blood in the bildge

[ktm_2000]

Here's a pic from the cabin of the boat looking to the stern
https://photos.app.goo.gl/KRvqyAqthWFwLuZAA

from foreground to background
Fishboxes, drains will go on either side of the center stringer in back
Battery boxes
Fuel tank area - unpainted
lastly old motorwell

Here's a side view of the motor well showing the gap of the center stringer which I left open right at the transom, hoses will come out here to the starboard side and y into a macerator pump
https://photos.app.goo.gl/kwjbLSwZW72VmASb9

[DanielM]

That is a good looking bilge. Nice work.

[Tony Meola]

Peter & Neil

If I understand what he is doing is making a fixed in place kill box. The hull is the bottom of the box so no way is he removing anything.

[Yannis]

What dia. hose will be connecting the fishbox to the motorwell/macerator?
I would assume 2” or more so it doesn't block with fish guts and scales.
Is there room to channel this hose(s) under the fuel tank? Cos if it doesn't go under the tank how else would there be natural gravity flow back to the macerator?

Why not put the mac pump inside the fishbox aftmost area, semi protected, channel the hose through the cc and out the side?
The visible “on the deck” part of the hose doesn't have to be permanent, you’ll be opening a small side hatch on the cc structure and reveal the hose to be extended out over the gunnel. Keep the motorwell for storage. Reduce fishgut areas to the minimum.
Reduce center stringer height to accept macerator Or make a through tube interconnecting the two sides. Use a sponge for last liter of dirty water.

[ktm_2000]

Tony Meola - That is exactly what I am doing.

Daniel, thanks for the comment, I've probably put too much effort into fairing under the deck.

Yannis - the center stringer is hollow and there is more than enough room to run a pair of 1 1/2" Inner diameter hoses in them. The idea of having the macerator pump closer and go out the mid section of the boat is an interesting one and I will look to see if I could figure out a way to do it. I do not want to mess with the main stringers and there is a u shaped notch for fuel fill hoses just aft of where my battery boxes are and I could pass additional hoses through that area.

[Mark]

What about running PVC pipe down the stringers instead of hoses? You can go with DWV pipe also and it will be thinner walled. Ideally you would be able to have a drop or drain pit right were the pipe come through the box. Could you raise the bottom of the box slightly by gluing 1” closed cell polyurethane foam sheets down to the hull and then notch/taper a small section where the pipe would come through the box? Fill/glass on top of foam from stringer to string and bulkhead to bulkhead. Glass pipe flush to box. No flange needed but I would suggest you put a screen to block large debris from potentially causing a blockage. If you do get a blockage, easier to remove screen and send snake down through PVC instead o putting hole in hose or having to pull the hose. Would be a little more work but might be worth it plus get a little insulation in bottom of box. Actually, probably should foam all sides and add it to hatch as well.

Mark

[ktm_2000]

Hi Mark,

I may be interpreting your post incorrectly when it comes to PVC Pipe, but the white Plumbing stuff at Home depot is rigid and there would be no way to get that inside of the stringer.

I was planning on using PVC Spa hose or the reinforced hose at west marine as I could pass an electrical snake down the stringer and tape it on and help pull the hose to its final spot.

Home depot spa hose
https://www.homedepot.com/p/UDP-1-1-2-i ... /304185154

West marine reinforced hose
https://www.westmarine.com/buy/shields- ... ecordNum=6

[Mark]

I may have missed some info from your other posts that would help so forgive is I state something you may have already said. So the drain has to go directly into the stringer in each box. Can't go through the back of the box at all, correct. So your drain out of the box is a 90 degree to hose or pipe going back. If so, what is inner diameter of your stringer? I know you said it was hollow. Is it smooth and consistent all the way back? The smallest OD on the hoses you are looking is 1.9 inches (By the way...same OD as PVC sch40). If stringer can not house both hoses at bottom of stringer, one will have to go over top of the other. Potential Issues for drainback and water being trapped. Not sure will you be able to pull hoses without binding either on the first hose or something inside the stringer. Might have to cut a bigger hole than you want to allow less of a radius when pulling. If you had to do that anyway, I would see if you could get the pvc pipe down, glue an elbow on and then glass/epoxy to box. That would be a push vs pull and might actually be less binding than a hose. Also if you use a hose with a flange and fish blood eventually leaks behind the flange, that will be inside your stringer/bilge. Ideally, you would go out the back of the box along the stringer and go straight back but sounds like that is not possible.

Good luck!

Mark

[ktm_2000]

Hi Mark,

You make good points, especially about the smooth and consistent all the way back and making sure this doesn't leak. I hope it is smooth but it is definitely not consistent. One thing I didn't mention is that there is actually another stringer inside the hollow one, it is about 2" high and follows the center line of the boat. I think that there is plenty of room in the center stringer, if you look at the bottom of the image, you will see the trapezoid area where I took out the center stringer to be able to make the fuel tank larger. I didn't measure but it is probably 7-8" wide at the bottom of the hull. The flat piece I put in to rest the fuel tank on has enough room under it for the hose, I tested it already.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/6tE8tpfbDWFKa6kd7

[ktm_2000]

the order of 35 feet of 1-1/2" tubing came in today. The tubing was shipped coiled up in a large diameter so It wasn't coiled up too bad. I unrolled it and put bricks on either end and let it sit for an hour. In the mean time I used a 3" diameter hole saw and cut openings in the center stringer and then used an electrician snake to run it down the length of the starboard stringer. When I had things ready I measured out the length of hose I needed and left myself an extra 1'. I cut both pieces and brought them in the boat and taped it up to the snake. I started feeding it in at the transom and my wife pulled the snake and it went through smoothly until I tried to get it out the small diameter hole. I ended up using a vise-grip plyers and clamping down on the end and pulling it out.

The hose on the port of the stringer didn't go so well.........

I thought I had plenty of room on either side of the stringer but in the old motor well, the smaller stringer inside of it was quite a bit off center and I couldn't pass the hose through. Out of frustration I passed it down the starboard side and then pushed it up and over the tiny center stringer just forward of the fuel tank then repeated with the vise grips to get it out of the drilled hole.

My buddy couldn't come over tonight to help me lift my fuel tank into the boat so I've got a little time to think about this before It becomes a pain to change my mind.

Mark's concern of drainback or water getting stuck is going to be a real problem so I might want to take the hose out and figure out a way to get past the restrictive point in the transom.

I'll take pics and post them tomorrow.

[Yannis]

How often do you think you would be emptying that fish box? 10-20 times per year?
I still think I’b put an ordinary high capacity bilge pump with a coiled hose somewhere inside the console and I’b be deploying it on the side.
Too many problems to resolve otherwise. If you think there will be so many guts in there that could block the bilge pump, then either put a proper macerator instead of a simple pump inside the fish box, or use your hands to remove the bigger bits and swirl the water so it flows correctly. Your hands should already smell of fish anyway !!

[ktm_2000]

Here's a pic I had in my library which I drew own a bit to show my thought process
https://photos.app.goo.gl/BAXHmZaMxGmTZxve8

You can see the opening which I outlined in a red line which shows where the center stringer originally was. You can also see the smaller stringer which exists inside the center stringer and how it is off center going into the motor well area. Right now I have the 2 1-1/2" hoses in on the starboard side.

My thoughts is that there are probably 3 options available to me

1. leave what I have in place where the port hose crosses the center stringer forward of the fuel tank.
2. Run the hose down the port side under the fuel tank and forward, then cut a small piece out of the back of the fuel tank base to allow the hose to cross over to the starboard side in the motor well area.
3. The area outlined in red should be open straight through to the transom. In looking at this pic, it seems that there is a cross brace that could be potentially cut out which would allow me to pass the hose through the port side of the center stringer then figure out some way to distort the tube from its circular shape turning it into an oval and allowing it to rest on the bottom of the hull.

I think I am going to investigate option #3 and if It doesn't look feasible I'm going to leave it as is as in reality there is a 1-2" inch lift in the hose forward and Yannis's idea of an external bilge pump would be good enough to get the last bit of water out of that side.

[Mark]

I like option 2 which was similar to my original post of running down the outside of the center stringer.

If you use a pump in the well as Yannis suggest, it will need to be in a pocket (never seen a pump that actually removes all the water) and depending on where you pump out and how that hose is run, you will have run back from that hose unless you put a check valve which will most likely get fouled by fish parts.

Ahhh, whats a boat without a little fish smell!!! That's the way it's supposed to be.

Mark

[ktm_2000]

After looking at the photos and thinking that there was some room to run the hose down the port site, there was. I ended up cutting the area around where the center stringer was and made the opening larger, only about 1" of extra width did the trick. From there it was fairly straight forward to pull the hose down the port side and it is sitting low in the bilge.

I squared off the port side
https://photos.app.goo.gl/9ofiYrRdYxWN1coq9

looking forward
https://photos.app.goo.gl/uiNoagaWTcZa7ZQG7

[ktm_2000]

I tried to install the drains and had a captain obvious moment hit me that the pieces I made were not right.

I used a piece of 3/4" high density plastic cutting board, cut to size and rounded over the corners with a router, then drilled the opening for the drain and installed with screws.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/JmZHcrkEZnrzD2Ki7

What wasn't to obvious to me is that the thickness of the piece doesn't allow installing a hose and then let the 90 degree curved portion sit inside the stringer.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/DzxxGWq5nnM4cFUu7

I will be off to a store this afternoon to find a cutting board that is right around 3/8" thick and start over again.

[ktm_2000]

I went out and bought a cutting board and went at round 2 of making the boards which will hold the drains. This time I think I got it right.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/KQPLyS81gUyUZR6w6
need to sand the edges a bit
https://photos.app.goo.gl/N5qNPzvD4ujQq67Y8

[ktm_2000]

I put in the 2nd try fishbox drains tonight for a test fit and they look decent. I'm going to pull them out so I can put a 4th coat of paint in the fishboxes tomorrow before gluing down the front deck panel. I will wait till spring and put a bead of 4200 and some screws to make the joint to the stringers water tight

port side
https://photos.app.goo.gl/PqBdVPqPsCrpeUF59
starboard side I had a little rubbing when I drilled out the hole, might have to put a 5th or 6th coat of paint here.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/G1MN61eAyYLsAMZA9