Cummings Sherwood Impeller Pump G1503

Keith Poe · Post by **Keith Poe** » Jul 4th, '14, 17:18

Guys what to do I found out the hard way they are an issue and read what Tony did for the 6 cylinders.

I need a complete pump new used in good condition and a major rebuild kit for the one that just failed.

Would like to over night need one fast any and all help would be truly appreciated.

wlbsr · Post by **wlbsr** » Jul 5th, '14, 12:17

Keith - i had problems with both the pumps on my boat when i bought it. Changed a couple of impellers within 75 hours on one and rebuilt the other. after i had problems with the rebuilt one i bit the bullet and bought 2 new sherwood pumps (should have consulted online first and i would not have bought sherwood). after about 175 hours, one of the new ones started leaking and had to be repaired. if money is not a concern i would buy 2 (or at least 1 for now) of the seaboard pumps knowing what i know now and it will probably save money in the long run. i kept the best of the two older sherwood pumps as a spare. at the first signs of a second round of trouble on the new sherwood pumps i will be changing to the seaboard pumps.

Keith Poe · Post by **Keith Poe** » Jul 5th, '14, 15:06

I would love to change those out to Tony's pumps but unfortunately there are only four or six cylinders not fours

wlbsr · Post by **wlbsr** » Jul 5th, '14, 16:33

Oops. Got it on the second read.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Jul 5th, '14, 17:25

Keith i have 2006 cummins 330 recon i have used since 2007 with zero problems this year i did not take the usual winter on the hard maintenance steps for the pumps that is put vegetable oil thru the pumps thru crash valves or what ever access you have after raw water intakes take off hose after thru valve if no other access . I ruin the impeller on spring start up (my fault) . I have both the four cylinder pump / and 210 hp, 250hp pump in perfect condition with new impeller and the latest and greatest sherwood 1730 2006 or newer 330 and 370hp. What ever you need bro just one question MAKO ;offset hook or straight hook? I have other rigging question when you have time. Pm me i sent photo.

Keith Poe · Post by **Keith Poe** » Jul 5th, '14, 18:26

I LOVE YOU BOB MY WIFE IS JEALOUS

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Jul 5th, '14, 18:34

Your the best! I love reading the great white adventures i will photo the 4 cylinder/ 210/ 250hp pump actually sherwood 1700 make sure it is the right pump!

Keith Poe · Post by **Keith Poe** » Jul 5th, '14, 18:39

Keith Poe · Post by **Keith Poe** » Jul 5th, '14, 18:52

Hello Bob here is a few pictures one is a new one and the other is the one I took off that failed.

I sent you a PM E-Mail with FedEx number and shipping address etc.

3105626205

THANK YOU

Keith Poe · Post by **Keith Poe** » Jul 5th, '14, 19:02

Shark Attack Today Manhattan Beach Great White

http://abcnews.go.com/US/swimmer-bitten ... d=24438491

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Jul 5th, '14, 19:28

Yep thats it i have it perfect condition with new impeller ready to go i will check pm.

Keith Poe · Post by **Keith Poe** » Jul 5th, '14, 19:32

I'm so happy thank you very much Bob

Keith Poe · Post by **Keith Poe** » Jul 5th, '14, 19:40

At least I know it's an issue now and can keep a close eye on it and build a stand by pump I also noticed the temp was slowly climbing up.
Also noticed having her on the trailer it fails before I can get out of the harbor saving me from offshore break downs.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Jul 5th, '14, 19:51

both inlet and out are straight is that ok. normally raw water supply is USCC type two and can bent has ss wire under outer rubber

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Jul 5th, '14, 19:55

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Jul 5th, '14, 19:58

keith what i have is the newer upgrade is the upgrade to your pump

Keith Poe · Post by **Keith Poe** » Jul 5th, '14, 19:58

Hey Bob I tried one like that but there's only a half inch clearance bottoms out underneath the priming pump for the fuel

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Jul 5th, '14, 20:01

if it stays on a trailer any lenth of time you will have to do the vegetable oil thing some just use dawn liquid detergent

Keith Poe · Post by **Keith Poe** » Jul 5th, '14, 20:01

On this pump the ports are 1" mine are 1.5"

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Jul 5th, '14, 20:08

i wish you had the " wizard" close to you he can cut your output elbow and weld it on this pump . Harry barb can do anything this is bronze i don`t weld bronze i should say braze that what i think he would do? does anybody braze bronze in your neck of the woods ? i reverse the output neck on my heat exchanger when i built the boat and that is critical because of soldered bundle internally this would be a walk in the park for harry.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Jul 5th, '14, 20:24

mine are also 1/12" it is 4th of july week end i don`t know if harry is monitoring this post.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Jul 5th, '14, 20:31

the sherwood 1730 pump used on 330/370 mech cummins has both upper and lower (input/output) at 45 degrees like yours but the pump is physically larger although front mount and gear is the same.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Jul 5th, '14, 20:38

i guess we will wait till harry or possibly carl gives there opinion .

Keith Poe · Post by **Keith Poe** » Jul 5th, '14, 21:02

Hello Bob thank you again for all your help very kind of you

What you can not see in the picture is the outlet on top is set way back under the priming pump.

I do plumbing all the time 35 years and there is not enough room for the 1" outlet if I put a sharp close elbow and a 4/5 will not work I can't see how a 1.5" would work.

I was thinking of removing the primer but it looks like it can not be removed it looks as though it has parts that go between the pump and valve.

this is from the other motor

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Jul 5th, '14, 21:08

The newer pump is longer and will clear the primer button but will still need new brazed 45degree output if you want he would insert the 1" output inside the 11/2 output and brazed it .that would be mealy a fill in braze job much easier

IRGuy · Post by **IRGuy** » Jul 5th, '14, 21:20

Keith...

I have a spare rebuilt (by Tony Athens tech) Sherwood 1730 raw water pump for my Cummins 6Bs. It looks like it has the same mount as yours, but the inlet and outlet are at on opposite sides at 90 and 270 deg. Each port has flat surfaces, and the inlet and outlet hoses have seperate 90 deg elbows that mate up to the pump flats with flanges bolted to the pump body and are sealed with an O ring. I'm not familiar with your pump, so I don't know if this will work for you.

I can take some pics and email them to you if you like.

If this can be any use to you I can ship it Monday.. maybe FedEx will accept it at the local airport on Sunday.

Let me know if you want to try this.. if it won't work you can ship it back.

Frank B

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Jul 5th, '14, 21:22

Keith give me the Total length of your existing pump from flange steel mounting plate to edge of rear of pump .

Keith Poe · Post by **Keith Poe** » Jul 5th, '14, 21:36

Thank you for the kind offer Frank but it's my understanding that pump will not work I asked Tony about it only for 6 cylinders.

Bob this is a 1" copper street ninety it looks like if I cut the bronze flange off and put the copper on there is only enough room for the 1" flange not sure a hose would fit over it no t much clearance and looks like 1.5" will not work.

A little longer throw on the end of the pump there is a solid fuel line in the way and another hard stop motor block.

tight fit for sure.

wmachovina · Post by **wmachovina** » Jul 5th, '14, 21:48

Fwiw the Sherwood pumps are crap for a boat used 12 mos. a year. Tony's pumps are a huge reliable upgrade. Now I think I have an old Sherwood maybe 2 at home. I get back tuesday, I'll check if you need them, Bill. I use them as door stoppers.

Keith Poe · Post by **Keith Poe** » Jul 5th, '14, 21:52

I hear you on the door stoppers I would love to buy and upgrade pump unfortunately there's none available I'm aware of

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Jul 5th, '14, 21:59

Just as i through your existing pump is 5" and the one i have is 61/4" that puts the output further back thru clearing the button to fuel prime.so you take the 11/2 " output and reduced with common bronze reducing fittings like barbed 1 1/2 by male thread an 45 degree female x female and a 11/2 male thread by 1" barbed --------done

Keith Poe · Post by **Keith Poe** » Jul 5th, '14, 22:10

I got you Bob I'm willing to try anything

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Jul 5th, '14, 22:21

Tony the 1730 pump is the other pump i described much to big in diameter in addition to vastly increased waterflow

Bob H. · Post by **Bob H.** » Jul 6th, '14, 06:15

Keith, after looking at the pics I see the flange that bolts to the engine and two bolts that attach the pump to the flange could you remove the bolts rotate a bit to provide clearance redrill and tap? If you need to braze try a tig torch and solder that is how my friend changed the direction of my heat exchanger outlet. BH

Keith Poe · Post by **Keith Poe** » Jul 6th, '14, 06:40

interesting I'll look at that when the Sun comes up this pump is only 1" though.

Bob do you think that can be done with your pump ?

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Jul 6th, '14, 21:16

Bob has a good sugestion reloadcating bolt holes to rotate pump but you mention you had access to a pump like mine check to see if additional length of this pump will clear primer button before any alteration.

Keith Poe · Post by **Keith Poe** » Jul 6th, '14, 23:27

Unfortunately I'm having trouble reaching the guy with the pump like yours Bob

Carl · Post by **Carl** » Jul 7th, '14, 08:27

I like the rotate and re-tap idea in gaining clearance.

Not a huge fan in brazing new fittings to the pump...especially down low near the body. A little distortion and you can have sealing problems, capacity diminishes and pump life is shortened. Odds are you'll be fine...but if its a simple rotate or braze, my money is on rotate.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Jul 7th, '14, 09:03

Carl it is not one or the other he has to reduce to 1 inch output thats why i gave the pipe fittings reduction post.this pump has a larger water volume then O.E.M. He has to go to a 45 degree output and reduce from 11/2 to 1" .one shot would be to braze on his output fitting the other is playing with fittings. I am not qualify to offer opinion on brazing but it sure would make this pump a shoe in.

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Jul 7th, '14, 10:12

Incidently if your referring to the two holes in large flange they are thru hole into engine definitely a major undertaking! If you are referring to the four holes that hole pump to smaller flange there are four blind holes in steel perhaps in a machine shop locating center of each hole ,spot with center drill and drill and tap four blind holes i think that would be quite a undertaking for a person with hand dril and vice. Just my humble opinion. I would cut straight output leave 1/2" and put his 1" output pipe inside and fil in with braze cleaning real good and after removing impeller heat flange with map gas hand torch then proceed with braze procedure there is no stress on this part and 1/2 " lip will prevent distortion and your going with bronze to bronze.

Carl · Post by **Carl** » Jul 7th, '14, 12:48

Only as an absolute last resort would I drill and tap block.

I was referring to the picture with two drilled and tapped holes Keith posted. From Bronze pump to adapter plate...and it is not a job to be done with a hand drill and tap.

Leaving a 1/2" piece protruding from housing to braze a 45 fitting should not disrupt much, if at all. I thought intention was to braze flush to body of housing.

Keith Poe · Post by **Keith Poe** » Jul 7th, '14, 16:37

I just drove 3 hours picked up a brand new one Tony found on the shelf 900 cash

bob lico · Post by **bob lico** » Jul 7th, '14, 19:40

Ok keith i was thinking limited funding like a small contribution to site and a 10 minute braze job .$900.00 is like price gouging the important factor is your under way again

Keith Poe · Post by **Keith Poe** » Jul 7th, '14, 20:30

thank you Bob Tony Athems was actually substantially less than everyone else

Carl · Post by **Carl** » Jul 8th, '14, 06:55

Bob- Nothing is ten minutes...unless you skip a few steps.

Underway with a new, unmodified, upgraded pump...good deal Keith!

Keith Poe · Post by **Keith Poe** » Jul 8th, '14, 07:12

Except for sex sometimes lol

Thanks, Carl

I'm going to have Stoll engines rebuild my old one as a spare

Rawleigh · Post by **Rawleigh** » Jul 9th, '14, 11:13

Keith for future reference a lot of the Sherwood pumps can have the front part attached to different cast rear housings. I did that on my Chrysler 440's. Depco Pump has a great selection and was helpful in my sorting out my problem. I went from a setup like yours with the inlet and outlet 180 degrees apart to one of the G series backs with the inlet and outlet coming out the same side. The main issue for you is how the tabs are "clocked" in relation to your front piece. the back off of a G1505 should fit your existing nose piece and mount.

http://www.sherwoodpumps.com/en-us/Prod ... oducts.htm

http://www.depcopump.com/brands.php

Keith Poe · Post by **Keith Poe** » Jul 9th, '14, 22:11

Very cool thank you pretty tired right now going to take a nap before i trailer home I caught a 400 and 800 pound Mako this