Page 1 of 1

Rudder Tie Rod Adjusting

Posted: Jul 12th, '06, 10:52
by Bottom Line
I am ready to connect the tie rod to the tiller arms with new tie rod ends (swivel sockets). Is there any "trick" to adjusting the length or is it just trial and error until it fits right? Thanks.
Mike

Posted: Jul 12th, '06, 11:03
by In Memory of Vicroy
You need to "toe in" the rudders, i.e. have the front edges one inch closer to each other than the trailing edges.

UV

Posted: Jul 12th, '06, 11:19
by Bottom Line
I wish I had taken a picture but I would swear that mine were set with the trailing edges about 1 inch closer. Does it make a difference whether they are toed in or out?

Posted: Jul 12th, '06, 11:29
by CaptPatrick
Mike,

Either way makes no real difference to the handlng of the boat, but with the rudders wider at the trailing edge makes a better "blue hole" of clear water behind the transom when trolling... Also it gives you a bit tighter turning radius.

Br,

Patrick

Posted: Jul 12th, '06, 12:40
by Bottom Line
Capt. Patrick: Good point. Any trick to adjusting or is it just trial and error in getting the length right?
Mike

Posted: Jul 12th, '06, 12:52
by CaptPatrick
Mike,

With the tie bar not connected to the tiller arms, but connected to the ram, turn you steering wheel to adjust the ram to dead center of its travel.

Set your rudders admidship and add the offset. Hold the tie bar above the tiller arms and adjust the connector ends to correspond to the tiller arms. This should be just about the location.

Hook everything up and turn the wheel hard over each way, marking the maximun travel of the rudders. Re-adjust as needed...

Br,

Patrick

Capt Pat...

Posted: Jul 14th, '06, 09:00
by IRGuy
Cap't Pat..

In reference to my Bertram 33.. with oversized rudders (rectangular blades, with some balancing area area forward of the rudder posts) how much would you suggest my rudders be out of parallel alignment. Above is mentioned 1" at the forward edges, but different rudder blade configurations would probably need different distances.. is there some angular spec you are aware of? We are discussing this subject presently on the Bertram33 site.

Posted: Jul 14th, '06, 10:43
by CaptPatrick
Guy,

There is probably little or no difference in the settings between different designs and sizes of rudders... Just don't exceed 1" of total distance between the trailing edges and the distance between the leading edges. 1/2" would be the minimum difference.

Br,

Patrick

Image

Cap't Pat.. One last question..

Posted: Jul 15th, '06, 09:30
by IRGuy
Thank you for the above.. but just to be sure I am correct.. I assume when you say....

"Just don't exceed 1" of total distance between the trailing edges and the distance between the leading edges."

That you mean that the total distance S+ plus P+ is more than 1/2" and less than 1" than the distance S- plus P-.

I hope I don't seem nitpicking here, but it seems important to be sure of such small dimensions, since it appears that a small error here might have a significant effect on the overall handling of any boat.

Posted: Jul 15th, '06, 11:29
by CaptPatrick
Guy,

Yup... Run a tape from trailing edge to trailing edge. That will be between 1/2" - 1' greater than a tape from leading edge to leading edge. Each rudder is offset by the same amount, or 1/2 of the total offset.

Br,

Patrick

Posted: Jul 15th, '06, 11:51
by IRGuy
Thanks Cap't Pat.. You da man!

Posted: Jul 17th, '06, 15:52
by Bottom Line
Capt. Patrick: I got the tie bar on and it may need some minor tweaking to get it just right but now another question. There seems to be a fair amount of "play" on the bar in that it swivels quite a bit on the tiller arm balls. I'm talking about a fore-aft swivel. Is there any way to tighten this up?
Mike

Posted: Jul 17th, '06, 16:45
by CaptPatrick
Mike,

There's two ways you can tighten the tie bar from sloppin' fore and aft.

1. you should have a threaded hole on the connector ends, opposite the end that fits onto the tiller arm. If you don't already have a square head lock bolt there, they are usually 1/4"x20. Position the bar vertically and drill a dimple into the tie bar, then install the lock bolts and tighten them down.

2. Have a couple of large nuts re-threaded to 3/4" NPT and put these on ahead of the connector ends. When everything is re-adjusted, tighten the nuts hard against the connector ends.

There will still be a bit of play but the tie bar won't flop back and forth.

Br,

Patrick

Posted: Jul 17th, '06, 16:53
by Bottom Line
Capt. Patrick: The connector ends do have the square head lock bolt. I tightened these down. The bar is not swivelling inside the connector ends. Rather it is piviting back and forth on the tiller arm ball because there is a cut out where the ball is inserted into the connector end.
Mike

Posted: Jul 17th, '06, 17:07
by CaptPatrick
Mike,

In that case you need to tighten down the large slotted retainer cap screw to remove the excess play. Inside each connector end there should be a spring, a plunger plug, then two SS 1/2 collars, & the retainer cap screw. The body of the connector end has holes to accomodate a cotter pin.

When it is adjusted correctly there should be no side to side play between the connector end and the ball joint of the tiller arm. The cotter pin will line up with the slot in the cap screw, securing it at that adjustment point.

Br,

Patrick

Posted: Jul 17th, '06, 17:09
by CaptPatrick
Mike,

In that case you need to tighten down the large slotted retainer cap screw to remove the excess play. Inside each connector end there should be a spring, a plunger plug, then two SS 1/2 collars, & the retainer cap screw. The body of the connector end has holes to accomodate a cotter pin.

When it is adjusted correctly there should be no side to side play between the connector end and the ball joint of the tiller arm. The cotter pin will line up with the slot in the cap screw, securing it at that adjustment point.

Br,

Patrick

Posted: Jul 18th, '06, 08:35
by Bottom Line
Capt. Patrick: I'll try that adjustment wehn I go to the boat Saturday. Thanks.
Mike

Re: Rudder Tie Rod Adjusting

Posted: Dec 16th, '12, 21:18
by Keith Poe
2006 right!

I need new springs any suggestions ?

Re: Rudder Tie Rod Adjusting

Posted: Dec 16th, '12, 21:47
by CaptPatrick
Keith,

You might be able to match them up on Amazon...

Re: Rudder Tie Rod Adjusting

Posted: Dec 17th, '12, 09:01
by Rawleigh
Mcmaster Carr would also be a place I would look.

Re: Rudder Tie Rod Adjusting

Posted: Dec 17th, '12, 17:32
by Keith Poe
Thanks you gentlemen