bertram31.com

A friend just sent me this link and said that I need a pair on the back of my boat. People love big boats (over 30') with OB's. I don't get it. This is insane. 557 hp

Bob you could put one on the back of you B20.

http://seven-marine.com/motors/

Came out at the miami show today.

I like the custom colors, that should add 25 kts. Just goes to prove there is a fool born every day. Probably so heavy it would take four democrats to steal one.

UV

i was thinking just "bump" the 350hp yamaha to 400hp but this looks real good for the b20

UV:

Does that mean I shouldn't consider this as a repower option for my B25?

Tom

UV,

You certianly are feeling better. That's a good one I won't forget.

How much? Wonder how long it will be before we see three of them in the stern of a 50 ft center console?

1000 lbs dry. 557ci V8 making 555 ft/lbs at 5,500 RPM's through a 90 degree ZF gearcase!!! The parts ought to fly far when it comes apart!!

Retail is about $75,000 each but that includes controls. I am being serious.

in that case i will take a pair of 300 hp yamaha/mercury at $ 54,000. and the confidents i could come back on one!

For 45k I'll take a pair of Yanmar 315's with the confidence I'll come back on BOTH of them........

I'll be satisfied with a Tee Shirt or Hat

hb

Guys remember that on 92 octane fuel
Capt. when we hanging a pair on the back of a 31!!


.. NOT

how right you are, and when you throw in the corn juice and hot day, and all the other varables you will have 575hp in your dreams.

first you take the wrong fork in the road and then you are too blind to realize it till you get to.............give me a break.

Bob,
Thats what people don't realize. Hp gains are in the upper limits of engine rpm where most people won't run.
Even our 31 repowered diesels are rated at their hp WOT and under fuel and air temp limits.

One good thing about them outboards over inboard...EZ and quick to change when they break down.

half the staff would be unemployed without those big 4- stroke outboards. godsent when you come to think of it ,those guys have families and this very rare winter with a ton of snow the long line of blown outboards is the only income. rather common everyday repairs you could set your watch on. yamaha 250/300/350hp lower unit will explode garrantee . mercury varado will develope (shadows ) --- computor glitches that drive you crazy and susuki lower unit problems. the great part is we can bring into maintenace building repair in good light/heat conditions and if powerhead just put boat outside .small diesel repair yanmar/ cummins ;terrible, you would starve if you had to pay the bills on that income. boss man said large diesel repair by outside pro`s , not worth it to carry that staff any more. they are here next day . catapillar in hours!

bob lico wrote:small diesel repair yanmar/ cummins ;terrible, you would starve if you had to pay the bills on that income.

Pretty much says it all.......

Pre breaking my neck, I was toying with the idea of bolding twin 225 outboards onto the back of my B25. Knowing that I will never be able to physically stand those speeds, and seeing all the comments about blowing up high horsepower outboards, and then the beancounter in me says, for about the same amount of money, I could put in two 4 cylinder diesel I/Os!

So, as she sits right now, my B25 has the old straight six 165hp i/os in her. Anyone have any experience/opinions on pulling them, and replacing with a single diesel i/o? Yanmar or Cummins, 315hp? What could I expect to cruising speed?

I'm thinking single due to fuel capacity and overall dimensions of the engine box.

Thanks,

Tom

tom i hope i did not misled you. we never get yamaha/ susuki/ mercury in the shop at 200hp or less . they can last a very long time it is just the fact of building a 350 hp with the same lower unit!
yammar screwed us with the 315hp stp-2 engine . they changed the sprinkler exhaust fitting to stainless from alluminum now the yammar diesel mech. are like the " may tag" washing machine repairman commercials sleeping in the chair!

Thanks Bob, no you didn't mislead me -- as a wise man on here once said, "it's all about the iron."

It is probably because I play with numbers all day long, but I just have a hard time grasping the concept of spending 18k and up for a big outboard, when I can probably put in a small diesel that will run forever, burning less fuel and for the same money!

AND I assume add to the resale value of the vessel if/when you want to sell it.

Good thought Walter. But they will be prying this Bertram from my cold, dead, hands! I'm going to take my time, get it right, and hopefully, still be able to run it long past retirement!

thinking out loud as i walk thru the shop every day . perhaps i am not as smart as these propective buyers of the the double 350 hp outboards. lets see for a 330hp inboard cummins i need a 11/2" aquanet 22 shaft ----right ! what makes you think you could put 350hp thru a 7/8" questionable steel shaft that has to go 90 degrees by way of a 3/4"spider gear . like i said i am not to smart ; i have computor glitches with the son-of a bitch sitting under my desk. what make you think it going to perform every day sitting two feet above salt water ,out in the open air , in extreme changes in temperature!

Bob:

Did you say "questionable steel 7/8" shaft?" Ha, come on now, that Chinese Stainless is amazing stuff! LMAO -- Somehow I ended up with some Chinese Stainless when I was putting in the hinges for my B31 engine boxes -- damned things rusted and stained my newly painted deck less than 1 month after installation -- high quality in that Chinese Stainless!

Tom

bob lico wrote:half the staff would be unemployed without those big 4- stroke outboards. godsent when you come to think of it ,those guys have families and this very rare winter with a ton of snow the long line of blown outboards is the only income. rather common everyday repairs you could set your watch on. yamaha 250/300/350hp lower unit will explode garrantee . mercury varado will develope (shadows ) --- computor glitches that drive you crazy and susuki lower unit problems. the great part is we can bring into maintenace building repair in good light/heat conditions and if powerhead just put boat outside .small diesel repair yanmar/ cummins ;terrible, you would starve if you had to pay the bills on that income. boss man said large diesel repair by outside pro`s , not worth it to carry that staff any more. they are here next day . catapillar in hours!

You also have to look at the ratio of outboard to diesels in the local area. It is most likely 15 to 1 ratio outboards to diesels.

true and in this marina maybe 30 to 1. i am in total agreement and this is not a cross section of the boating world. at $149.00 a foot we have only a handful of blubliners.to make matters worst at least 15 lawyers/ financhal investers that leave there boat at the outside gas dock because they have no clue on how to dock a 35' cc or clean it ! they meet on sunday morning to get away from nagging wife`s.the dock boys clean and put away the boat while they drink at our bar.

Sounds like my kinda boating.

UV

you would be at home vic roy. the goldman sach boys pass out secret ipo`s and they exchanged all kinds of wall street adventures. college kids whom are the dock boys sit in awe friday night when they bring brooklyn decker look alike "paralegals" to the mariner. all clears are free just bring bottle once in a while.

OK Bob, Now you got me wondering......

Last week your talking about hand knit mini skirts with matching G-strings !!!
This week it's Brooklyn Decker Look-A-Likes....

You gotta second life after the sun goes down on that marina....???

Ray

i may drive the boat but i do take notice. some of these dudes have a retirement fund of 500.000 a month . needed to say some extreme high maintenace women sometimes are attracted to life in the fast lane,and oh yes the latest in fashions.a famous waterfront restarant est. 1928 next store and one down the block. break out the menu as they sit under the tent on waters edge and one of the dock boys goes to the restarant and brings back lunch like oysters or clams casino . very deep pockets!

Bob

High Maintence boats and high maintence woman go hand in hand.

Vicroy wrote:Sounds like my kinda boating.

UV

Careful UV, your decending into the bowls of HOWDY BOATING.

Once there, there is no escape. They will make you sell the 31 for a bayliner or sea ray or worse a carver.

Once a 31 is entered into howdy boating, it starts to delaminate in a self inflicted attempt to sink to the bottom to hide the shame.

Been witness to several of these events. Luckily the boats were sold, I repaired their dignity and they once again proudly cut through rough inlets looking to kill some fish.

When the big 4 strokes came out on the market the boat companies had to redistribute the weight of the boats to accommodate the heavier motors.

Triple 350 weigh about 1600lbs. For a total of 1050hp. Two of these motors exceed 2000lbs so you pick up nominal hp and 400lbs.

If you swap out quad 350s for triple 557s the power to weight ratio gets worse.

If you ask me for a big center console I like the Sea Vee with inboards.

PeterPalmieri wrote:When the big 4 strokes came out on the market the boat companies had to redistribute the weight of the boats to accommodate the heavier motors.

Triple 350 weigh about 1600lbs. For a total of 1050hp. Two of these motors exceed 2000lbs so you pick up nominal hp and 400lbs.

If you swap out quad 350s for triple 557s the power to weight ratio gets worse.

If you ask me for a big center console I like the Sea Vee with inboards.

Yamaha 350hp are 804lbs each.

I do agree that the weight of OB has become less of an issue as current boats are designed for the extra weight. 2000lbs on the transom of a 47ft Intrepid is not a big deal. In the youtube video on the new 560hp OB Intrepid CEO states they are coming out with a 54ft OB Express.

I spend a couple of days on 47ft Intrepid sport yacht with quad 300hp Verados and the quality was second to one. It gets just shy of 1mpg and tops out over 50mph.

Wow. I was way off on my weight specs on the 350s. I guess it actually swings the other way you save 400 lbs with these new motors. They'll have to have big plans to provide local service on these motors though.

A 57ft center console with outboards is insane, I guess if there is a market for them what the heck. I've got two friends with 36' yellowfins, triple outboards. Not my cup of tea but they love them. Young guys With lots of money and limited time. They pick there days and run to the canyon before the sun comes up and are back home in time to put the kids to bed.

To each there own.

Am I the only guy who has gone offshore on a lovely morning with a good weather report and has had to beat my way back like a sequence in "Victory at Sea"? I wouldn't have wanted to have been on anyone's center console thank you.

capt. bone just a shot in the dark; by any chance did that 47' intrepid have the quad verados painted white with custom teak work ? was the purchaser was sam katzs from kings point?

walterk wrote:Am I the only guy who has gone offshore on a lovely morning with a good weather report and has had to beat my way back like a sequence in "Victory at Sea"? I wouldn't have wanted to have been on anyone's center console thank you.

Walter, I'm with you. but many are not. We have a client that runs out to the canyon when he gets a call from friends out their when reports and weather are good. If his day dictates he'll drop everything hop in the boat and run out at 60-70mph, fly fish for a bit then run back in. Bad weather and he goes in sooner...for him its only and hour and a half ride...not sure what happens if he gets caught in something or looses a motor...maybe jumps on with a friend. Whatever...to each his own.

sim wrote:not sure what happens if he gets caught in something or looses a motor...

Or hits a whale.....

Walter I agree the canyon in a center console is not my idea of fun. I've got a lot of friends who disagree and I must say it works for them.

The 31 contender, 26 regulator and now the 36 yellow fin have become popular by me. Fish by yourself in the back bay or run offshore with a crew. In a center console you can chase down breaking tuna, driving the boat with a rod in your hand drop it in neutral and make a cast.

Still don't see the appeal of a 40'+ center console though. Bob told me a story about getting to the canyon in a large cabin boat and the owner cracking open wine and horderves in the salon now that sounds nice!

We all need at least three boats or lots of rich friends.

Peter, I'll tell you being off shore on the 95' Jim Smith this summer was not to be rivalled. I took a hot, comfortable shower at 33 knots on the ride home. It was enough to make me not really feel like fishing my 31 for a bit... I enjoyed the Bertram, don't get me wrong, but being offshore on Marlena was a whole other ballgame, and I got spoiled fast.

33 plus knot cruise on a 95' boat. It was incredible. And 250 gallons an hour...

That all being said, I have a good friend who runs a 38' Fountain with triple 275 verados. Yes, he has had his fair share of issues, specifically lower units. But what a boat. Yes, what a boat. Big water, she handles it just fine. You slow down from 55 mph to 35 and it is not wet, and not crazy. I'd take it in a heartbeat.

Dug

I hate to be the pro outboard guy but I'm not sure I like the idea of losing a motor or hitting a whale any less in either type of boat.

peter i have gone to the canyon on the fastest fishing boat ever built that i am aware of. i don`t have pictures because he is not at the marina anymore . i can`t remember the name of boat but it is a famous 32' cat built near bruce`s shop in florida. twin 480hp yanmars with 3 speed transmissions. had twin half canopies in each sponson. we worked the props and exhaust until he was happy. cruise all day at 76mph and top out at 102 mph . fiberglass outriggers we remove and put down center of boat on sole. rods stored in v-berth .at 76 mph we got triple the fuel enconomy as that 47' intrepid.we quad 300hp verados. trust me when i tell you you cannot exceed 30mph in the atlantic ocean going to the canyon! you have your eyes so focus for so long you get a headache and you still hit that damm log or whatever. same old shit like the 34' fountain (at least 2mph faster then regulator,yellowfin,contender)how fast do you go tom " 63mph" ok how fast did you get back from the canyon "oh man it was terrible like 18mph" thank you thanks the real story meanwhile bob is in the 45' cabo with a well stocked wine refrigerator and chicken cutlet parm. for lunch making 28mph all day.when your on the way in a fresh pot of coffee and bagles and lox. or get my ass kicked in a cc thats why i charge 75.00 a hour to take you to the canyon in you fancy 36' yellowfin and take the cabo free!

bob lico wrote:capt. bone just a shot in the dark; by any chance did that 47' intrepid have the quad verados painted white with custom teak work ? was the purchaser was sam katzs from kings point?

It was on the North Shore at Manhasett YC. It was Green hull with white engines. The captain told me the owner has a private jet leasing company. The boat had a full time private captain and a full time deckhand. He brought the boat up from FL. Everything was wired to be done was a remote tablet computer. Amazing boat.

thats him , he is the ceo. of talon air and i was with the capt. drive up to mahogony dock and press a button the boat goes in the air .kings point with view of city skyline and throgs neck bridge. huge ego!!!

capt. bone that 47' intrepid was a great handling boat in 2to3' of the western sound the captain had her about 10% of the pins and she register about 107/108 gph on the digital ---what the hell he had deep pockets .captain and mate are actually on call .did you like that teak and sole ? quite a job, never saw that use of teak on that type of boat before.

Bob

I hear you, the dual rear stateroom, in hull windows, and performance made me a big fan. I was on the boat for several days with the captain.

I couldnt afford to run the boat because of fuel even if you gave me the boat but one can dream.

capt. bone knowing the owner i imagine he went to the intrepid factory and broke there balls until he got everything he wanted. can you imagine having your own travelift at the end of a 250' dock. bottom of boat had to be 8' above high water mark so salt water would not spash on bottom of boat. carpenters grain match mahogony planks going out to boat along with stainless steel cables with routered ipe top piece, so the railing would not obstruck his view. underwater stereo music in glass infinity pool. you just can`t make this stuff up!

A bit off topic but most of these monster outboards are powering big center console boats. I can say I do love fishing off a center console boat.

With the mega bucks being spent on these triple and quadruple outboard machines I wonder why boats like the Gamefisherman or Scopinich aren't more popular. The walk around versions of these boats are pretty sweat. You get the 360 fishability of a center console and significantly more protection and comfort then a center console. And these boats handle like a sports fishing boat.

Ok back to reality.