What does it take to get people to get it?
Now how many millions of dollars in public funds will be spent searching and perhaps rescuing or ransoming these fools because they didn't do due dilligence in their prep?
*Note the bold, damn thats old.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,569747,00.html
Somali pirates said Tuesday they have seized a British couple and their yacht in the Indian Ocean during their round-the-world voyage. The couple had been missing for four days.
Fears for the safety of Paul and Rachel Chandler from Tunbridge Wells have been mounting since the emergency beacon aboard their 38-foot yacht the Lynn Rival went off last week.
“We have captured two old British [people], a man and woman in the Indian Ocean, they were on a small boat that we have hijacked,†a pirate called Mohamed Shakir told The Times of London by phone from Haradheere in Somalia.
The pirate added that the two were “healthy and in our hands†but would not say where they would be taken. Ransom demands are likely to follow.
The U.K. Foreign Office said they have been in touch with the couple's family in England, and have contacted the Coast Guard in Seychelles, who continue to monitor the situatiion and search of the area.
The office is reportedly treating the disappearance as a missing persons case, and have two British Navy ships searching the area. It could be 18-24 hours before they have a fix on the yacht.
The Chandlers left the Seychelles on Thursday, heading for Tanzania via the Amirante Islands. Their emergency position-indicating radio beacon was activated on Friday.
Andrew Mwangura, head of the East Africa Seafarers’ Assistance Programme based in the Kenyan port of Mombassa, confirmed that the Lynn Rival was missing with two British crew on board.
A Foreign Office spokesman said: “We are aware of the report. We are investigating urgently.â€
The couple, both in their late 50s, have been sailing around the world. The last message on their blog, entered shortly before the distress signal was sent, reads simply: “PLEASE RING SARAHâ€.
The previous entry, written before leaving the Seychelles, was full of preparations for their voyage. “We’ll be at sea for 8 to 12 days, maybe 14 as we are now getting into the period of transition between the south monsoon and north monsoon, so the trade winds will be less reliable and we may get more light winds," they wrote.
In the past two weeks there have been at least five ships seized by pirates in the waters off the Seychelles. Activity has picked up in recent weeks as Monsoon winds and rains have died down.
This year there have been some 174 ships attacked by pirates off Somalia, 36 of which are being held. At least 587 people are being held hostage. Ransoms being paid out in recent months total in the tens of millions of dollars. The pace of hijackings is running ahead of last year.
Cruising dangers
Moderators: CaptPatrick, mike ohlstein, Bruce
I get the idea of wanting to cruise around the world, climb Mount Everest, Dive to the deepest depths, hike in the remote-est (new word) of areas etc etc.
But I think if your going to take these activities on... you need to to take on the responsibility of getting yourself out of the consequences of the dangers these activities present.
I don't see why some idiots can decide to risk someones elses (AKA rescuers) life so they can have their jollies (lifelong dream). At the end of a needless rescue, the rescue- ees (another new word) should be presented with a bill for the services rendered...kind of like Sea-Tow, Membership Card, Cash or Credit Card, thank you.
If your going to chart thru water where it is well known Pirates monitor, my thought is too bad, sorry...on the flip side of that I think if pirates capture someone who blatantly entered dangerous waters and calls for help.. the governments involved should offer the pirates a choice...give them up in the next hour or we blow you out of the water. The only response needed is the safe release of XYZ. Thank you and have a nice day.
But I think if your going to take these activities on... you need to to take on the responsibility of getting yourself out of the consequences of the dangers these activities present.
I don't see why some idiots can decide to risk someones elses (AKA rescuers) life so they can have their jollies (lifelong dream). At the end of a needless rescue, the rescue- ees (another new word) should be presented with a bill for the services rendered...kind of like Sea-Tow, Membership Card, Cash or Credit Card, thank you.
If your going to chart thru water where it is well known Pirates monitor, my thought is too bad, sorry...on the flip side of that I think if pirates capture someone who blatantly entered dangerous waters and calls for help.. the governments involved should offer the pirates a choice...give them up in the next hour or we blow you out of the water. The only response needed is the safe release of XYZ. Thank you and have a nice day.
dont blame the victim...blame the criminals. i just dont get this whole thing. i dont see why the international community dosent draw a line say 30 miles offshore and tell the somalis they are going to sink any boat that crosses it ...no questions asked. appropriate response to piracy.
that said when we cruised the caribbean in the early 70s we had someone armed on deck 24/7 (while at anchor) no one approached anyone to close at sea...good way to get shot.
i dont think there is anyone on this site that hasnt repeatedly put themselves in situations that could if things went very wrong require rescue.
and thats just the ocean....some of us can throw in the mountains too.
that said when we cruised the caribbean in the early 70s we had someone armed on deck 24/7 (while at anchor) no one approached anyone to close at sea...good way to get shot.
i dont think there is anyone on this site that hasnt repeatedly put themselves in situations that could if things went very wrong require rescue.
and thats just the ocean....some of us can throw in the mountains too.
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Brewster Minton
- Senior Member
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- Location: Hampton Bays NY
- Contact:
Randall,
You have to use some sort of common sense knowing the dangers that lurk.
The marked increase in pirate hijacks in that area broadcasted around the world over the last few years kinda takes all the guess work out of should I or shouldn't I cruise near those waters due to the inherant increased risk.
That's not taking a risk.
Thats just down right being stupid.
The reason why they won't draw a line in the sand is because of hostages of which the current story adds two more.
With the pirates holding over 500+ people the world won't risk a blood bath of 500 or so corpses. As long as the pirates are left free to roam or realize the bodies still have a value, they are alive.
The minute that changes, all those people are dead.
I say send Bill Clinton.
He got those two dopey journalists that wandered into N Korea freed.
How big a blank check from the US he carried will never be known.
Stupidity needs to stop being rewarded. Darwin is being cheated out of his just desserts.
You have to use some sort of common sense knowing the dangers that lurk.
The marked increase in pirate hijacks in that area broadcasted around the world over the last few years kinda takes all the guess work out of should I or shouldn't I cruise near those waters due to the inherant increased risk.
That's not taking a risk.
Thats just down right being stupid.
The reason why they won't draw a line in the sand is because of hostages of which the current story adds two more.
With the pirates holding over 500+ people the world won't risk a blood bath of 500 or so corpses. As long as the pirates are left free to roam or realize the bodies still have a value, they are alive.
The minute that changes, all those people are dead.
I say send Bill Clinton.
He got those two dopey journalists that wandered into N Korea freed.
How big a blank check from the US he carried will never be known.
Stupidity needs to stop being rewarded. Darwin is being cheated out of his just desserts.
Heres another story that proves my point.
Hiking in Iraq and Iran. At all but right now?
Calling Bill Clinton...The savior of people with *hit for brains.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,569758,00.html
The families of three Americans detained in Iran say newly released videos prove their loved ones were on vacation and had no hidden motives when they crossed into the country from Iraq.
Shane Bauer, 27, Sarah Shourd, 31, and Josh Fattal, 27, have been detained in Iran since July 31. Their families say they entered the Islamic Republic accidentally while hiking in a scenic area of northern Iraq.
The families, who have had no contact with the detainees, released videos shot of them dancing and singing before they were captured by Iranian authorities.
"These kids were on vacation. They were just traveling; they were having a good time," Shourd's mother, Nora Shourd, said in a phone interview Monday.
Iranian Foreign Minister Manouchehr Mottaki said last week that investigators are still questioning the three and that their fate rests with judicial authorities. Bauer, Shourd and Fattal have been visited by Swiss diplomats, who oversee U.S. interests in Iran.
Mottaki gave no other details on the case. But his comments suggested that formal charges could still be possible against the Americans, although Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad said in an interview with The Associated Press last month that he could ask the judiciary to "take a look at the case with maximum leniency."
One of the videos, posted on YouTube Tuesday, shows Fattal performing an impromptu rap song — "Yo, it's hot/It's 'cos I'm in Iraq." — against a backdrop of the Iraqi city of Irbil.
A second video shows Fattal, Bauer and Shourd dancing in an unfinished cinder block building.
"It's obvious they're on vacation. This makes it real clear that they were there having fun," said Bauer's mother, Cindy Hickey, who lives in Minnesota. "This is a carefree attitude and not an attitude of someone that was meaning to do harm."
But it was hearing his voice that really affected her.
"It took me aback," Fattal said. "I said, 'That's really Josh. And I really haven't heard from him.' When you hear a voice, that pulls at your heartstrings."
As for his rapping ability, Fattal said, "Of course I think he's adorable."
More importantly, she said, the two videos show "the harmless nature of all three of them."
Fattal, who lives in Elkins Park, Pa., a suburb of Philadelphia, said she and the other two mothers traveled to the Iranian mission to the U.N. in New York on Oct. 15 to deliver a petition signed by more than 2,500 people asking that the hikers be released.
Iranian authorities have had nearly three months to question the hikers, Fattal said.
"I can't imagine what else they're expecting to hear," she said.
The videos were made two days before the hikers were detained. They were shot by Shon Meckfessel, a fourth American on the trip who did not go hiking with the others because he was feeling ill.
Shourd, Bauer and Fattal are friends who all graduated from the University of California, Berkeley. Bauer had been living in Damascus, Syria, with Shourd, his girlfriend. Fattal went to visit them after traveling overseas on a teaching fellowship with the International Honors Program.
Watching the videos has been bittersweet, Hickey said.
"It was kind of fun to see that they were having fun and they were being kids," she said. "But it also made me really wonder why they're still being held. It made me miss Shane even more."
Nora Shourd, who lives in Oakland, said she's watched the videos "50 times already."
"It's wonderful to see them. It's wonderful to see Sarah dancing and they're really having a good time," she said. "But then I feel the opposite, which is — Why in the world are they sitting in a jail in Iran?"
The Associated Press contributed to this report.
Hiking in Iraq and Iran. At all but right now?
Calling Bill Clinton...The savior of people with *hit for brains.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,569758,00.html
The families of three Americans detained in Iran say newly released videos prove their loved ones were on vacation and had no hidden motives when they crossed into the country from Iraq.
Shane Bauer, 27, Sarah Shourd, 31, and Josh Fattal, 27, have been detained in Iran since July 31. Their families say they entered the Islamic Republic accidentally while hiking in a scenic area of northern Iraq.
The families, who have had no contact with the detainees, released videos shot of them dancing and singing before they were captured by Iranian authorities.
"These kids were on vacation. They were just traveling; they were having a good time," Shourd's mother, Nora Shourd, said in a phone interview Monday.
Iranian Foreign Minister Manouchehr Mottaki said last week that investigators are still questioning the three and that their fate rests with judicial authorities. Bauer, Shourd and Fattal have been visited by Swiss diplomats, who oversee U.S. interests in Iran.
Mottaki gave no other details on the case. But his comments suggested that formal charges could still be possible against the Americans, although Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad said in an interview with The Associated Press last month that he could ask the judiciary to "take a look at the case with maximum leniency."
One of the videos, posted on YouTube Tuesday, shows Fattal performing an impromptu rap song — "Yo, it's hot/It's 'cos I'm in Iraq." — against a backdrop of the Iraqi city of Irbil.
A second video shows Fattal, Bauer and Shourd dancing in an unfinished cinder block building.
"It's obvious they're on vacation. This makes it real clear that they were there having fun," said Bauer's mother, Cindy Hickey, who lives in Minnesota. "This is a carefree attitude and not an attitude of someone that was meaning to do harm."
But it was hearing his voice that really affected her.
"It took me aback," Fattal said. "I said, 'That's really Josh. And I really haven't heard from him.' When you hear a voice, that pulls at your heartstrings."
As for his rapping ability, Fattal said, "Of course I think he's adorable."
More importantly, she said, the two videos show "the harmless nature of all three of them."
Fattal, who lives in Elkins Park, Pa., a suburb of Philadelphia, said she and the other two mothers traveled to the Iranian mission to the U.N. in New York on Oct. 15 to deliver a petition signed by more than 2,500 people asking that the hikers be released.
Iranian authorities have had nearly three months to question the hikers, Fattal said.
"I can't imagine what else they're expecting to hear," she said.
The videos were made two days before the hikers were detained. They were shot by Shon Meckfessel, a fourth American on the trip who did not go hiking with the others because he was feeling ill.
Shourd, Bauer and Fattal are friends who all graduated from the University of California, Berkeley. Bauer had been living in Damascus, Syria, with Shourd, his girlfriend. Fattal went to visit them after traveling overseas on a teaching fellowship with the International Honors Program.
Watching the videos has been bittersweet, Hickey said.
"It was kind of fun to see that they were having fun and they were being kids," she said. "But it also made me really wonder why they're still being held. It made me miss Shane even more."
Nora Shourd, who lives in Oakland, said she's watched the videos "50 times already."
"It's wonderful to see them. It's wonderful to see Sarah dancing and they're really having a good time," she said. "But then I feel the opposite, which is — Why in the world are they sitting in a jail in Iran?"
The Associated Press contributed to this report.
Last edited by Bruce on Oct 27th, '09, 14:20, edited 2 times in total.
True the criminals are the problem, your 100% correct.
But if they did not have people to prey upon they would stop.
The international community is worse then our own govenrment when it comes to this. I believe they/we should sink them as you stated. They would get the hint quickly.
As to rescuers, again you are correct. I have been in some touchy situations that could have gone wrong...very wrong.
That is not exactly what I'm saying. I'm thinking along the lines where people get themselves into trouble where clear indicators and warnings are present...yet some continue to venture further with the expectation that if things go South, they will just call for rescue.
But if they did not have people to prey upon they would stop.
The international community is worse then our own govenrment when it comes to this. I believe they/we should sink them as you stated. They would get the hint quickly.
As to rescuers, again you are correct. I have been in some touchy situations that could have gone wrong...very wrong.
That is not exactly what I'm saying. I'm thinking along the lines where people get themselves into trouble where clear indicators and warnings are present...yet some continue to venture further with the expectation that if things go South, they will just call for rescue.
they cant rescue you if you dead. i have seen some totally inane stuff in the back country by people that were totally unaware of where they were.
once 3 "tourists" followed my (and a friend's) tracks on a powder day. we stopped at the top of a large unskied untracked bowl . as inviting as it looked we opted to ski down in the trees. the three guys jumped right into the middle. we were almost back to the road when we heard the chopper. 2 dead one very lucky. (i dont know if he had to pay for the rescue)
that said no one is immune. if you wander offshore, dive, climb mountains, or ski out of bounds , etc.....i have lost friends doing all of these things. all four people i knew who died in the mountains (on separate occasions) were world class professional mountaineers and super experienced......
you never know.
if i was going to sail off somalia i would use the wind advantage and stay out of small motor boat range.....and maybe a rocket launcher?
once 3 "tourists" followed my (and a friend's) tracks on a powder day. we stopped at the top of a large unskied untracked bowl . as inviting as it looked we opted to ski down in the trees. the three guys jumped right into the middle. we were almost back to the road when we heard the chopper. 2 dead one very lucky. (i dont know if he had to pay for the rescue)
that said no one is immune. if you wander offshore, dive, climb mountains, or ski out of bounds , etc.....i have lost friends doing all of these things. all four people i knew who died in the mountains (on separate occasions) were world class professional mountaineers and super experienced......
you never know.
if i was going to sail off somalia i would use the wind advantage and stay out of small motor boat range.....and maybe a rocket launcher?
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scenarioL113
- Senior Member
- Posts: 689
- Joined: May 31st, '08, 09:00
- Location: Massapequa Park, NY
scenarioL113 wrote:DO NOT GO ON VACATION IN OR AROUND THE THIRD WORLD!!!!!
If you heed that warning you will not be seized by pirates, or taken into custody by some Islamic Fanatical country!
Very Simple, there is plenty to see right here in the good old USA!
i hope you're not serious. capt patrick took that avatar photo of me in the "third world"
what bothers me most is to have a super tanker loaded with oil that must past along the somalia coast unarmed! 200million dollars with no protection-----crazy. one m-2 50caliber machine gun mounted on a yoke at the fantail. they normally approach with a 22' skiff with a 100hp yamaha armed with ak-47 rifles. at 1500yard 1 burst for range and second for effect.there is absolutly nothing you can do to defend yourself from a 50cal even in a speedboat those bullets can go right thru the engines with ap rounds. i know the weapon well and would fire at the gas tank .mind well incenerate the bastards while your at it!!!
capt.bob lico
bero13010473
bero13010473
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In Memory Walter K
- Senior Member
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- Location: East Hampton LI, NY
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We give these bastards far too much publicity, and they are taking great advantage of it. Fifty years ago they would have quietly killed every one of them off, and whoever was left would be running as far inland as fast as they could. Now with communications being what they are, there's the fear of being reported on as being "bad industrialists" and the ship owners even being hauled up on charges to the Hague. What we need is a news blackout on the matter and a clandestine group of multinational mercenary swat teams. No government would have to pay for it, the ship owners would gladly do so "off the books" if they weren't afraid of the possible bad press.
No Walter, I think the matter should be handled in the press, press release, notice to marinas anything to get the word out.
But we have to deal with it, not tip toe around the problem hoping some other country will step up. Let it be know if you hyjack a US Flagged Ship, A ship with US Citizens, A ship with US cargo, etc we will not negotiate, you will be attacked.
Blow them up, sink them, kill them whatever it takes. If owners and wourld peace and envirnmental people don't like the idea of possible losing a ship, its' cargo and people then take another route.
Pirates do what they do becasue they have nothing to lose and everything to gain. Until that is changed, they will continue to go about what they are doing. They need to know they will lose...period.
I don't see the US doing this as we worry about what everyone in the world thinks. We cave into environmentalists because they are loud and feed on emotions. Personally I think we are sinking because we just don't take appropriete action untill we sit and think on it for several days, weeks... by then it's too late.
If owners and insurance companies cannot put arms on bourd they should hire escorts who can travel with them.
But we have to deal with it, not tip toe around the problem hoping some other country will step up. Let it be know if you hyjack a US Flagged Ship, A ship with US Citizens, A ship with US cargo, etc we will not negotiate, you will be attacked.
Blow them up, sink them, kill them whatever it takes. If owners and wourld peace and envirnmental people don't like the idea of possible losing a ship, its' cargo and people then take another route.
Pirates do what they do becasue they have nothing to lose and everything to gain. Until that is changed, they will continue to go about what they are doing. They need to know they will lose...period.
I don't see the US doing this as we worry about what everyone in the world thinks. We cave into environmentalists because they are loud and feed on emotions. Personally I think we are sinking because we just don't take appropriete action untill we sit and think on it for several days, weeks... by then it's too late.
If owners and insurance companies cannot put arms on bourd they should hire escorts who can travel with them.
As long as insurance companies run the world, you'll see no self defense on commercial shipping.
Its much cheaper to let the shipping company pay a ransom, than pay out a claim for a bunch of dead sailors and lost cargo.
Like the journalists in N Korea, ma and pa sailor and now these kids in Iran, the world will want them released instead of just saying, sticking your pecker thru the fence at the lions exhibit has its consequences.
Deal with it. Your on your own.
Its much cheaper to let the shipping company pay a ransom, than pay out a claim for a bunch of dead sailors and lost cargo.
Like the journalists in N Korea, ma and pa sailor and now these kids in Iran, the world will want them released instead of just saying, sticking your pecker thru the fence at the lions exhibit has its consequences.
Deal with it. Your on your own.
There is another more important reason than insurance worries, as I understand it, that merchant vessels are not armed. The main reason merchant ships are not armed is because some ports of call do not allow vessels to enter port while armed. In addition, I think that some countries will not flag vessels that are or will be armed.
I might be wrong about that, but I am pretty sure that it is correct. Why shipping companies don't put pressure on these ports to allow special licensing or exceptions I don't know.
I might be wrong about that, but I am pretty sure that it is correct. Why shipping companies don't put pressure on these ports to allow special licensing or exceptions I don't know.
the question here is what constitude " armed" . a hunting rifle does not make a merchant ship armed .i belive it would be a exposed cannon or rocket launcher. having a private company perform the guard duty (ex special opps) with his own arms has to be legal . like in iraq not mentioning names-black----
capt.bob lico
bero13010473
bero13010473
Depending on the port of call, yes arms can be illegal to posses on board.
But trips I've done from the US to foreign ports where firearms are illegal have gotten around this by slipping the customs inspectors a few bucks and a couple shots of good booze.
Bob,
I love how your mind works. What constitutes armed.
Unfortunatly we are a minority.
Armed to most of the world can be a zip gun.
How to deal with pirates, terrorists and their clans 101........
Turn up the volume.
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But trips I've done from the US to foreign ports where firearms are illegal have gotten around this by slipping the customs inspectors a few bucks and a couple shots of good booze.
Bob,
I love how your mind works. What constitutes armed.
Unfortunatly we are a minority.
Armed to most of the world can be a zip gun.
How to deal with pirates, terrorists and their clans 101........
Turn up the volume.
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/Gz3Cc7wlfkI&hl ... ram><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/Gz3Cc7wlfkI&hl=en&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>
yea bruce you and i pull the hidden m-40 out of the hidden locker with the spotting scope .i work the elevation/windage and you on the trigger.you chamber one of those 416 caliber rounds look at the skiff coming at 1500 yards. now here is the differance sombody else might play smashing pumpkins with the somalia`s but you look at the RED can in front of the outboard .hmm lets see 1' down from the top will be fumes let me just sqeeze the trigger.-----explosion and flames -----i turn to you "yea one shot 6 kill "i wonder if anybody will missed them. and the container ship continues on it`s merry way.
capt.bob lico
bero13010473
bero13010473
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scenarioL113
- Senior Member
- Posts: 689
- Joined: May 31st, '08, 09:00
- Location: Massapequa Park, NY
thanks but the term "third world" covers a lot of territory. hell....i played ball in cuba and was far safer in havana than on the streets of any American city at 2 in the morning.
anyone here who went fishing in panama will tell you there wasnt much to fear . i did hair out surfing alone at the rivermouth (after an hour) but it was sharks and not pirates that worried me.
and how many here fish mexico, guatemala, belize, etc etc or shoot birds in bolivia.
its a big world out there full of all kinds of great opportunities. does that mean you should go trekking in afghanistan? no .
anyone here who went fishing in panama will tell you there wasnt much to fear . i did hair out surfing alone at the rivermouth (after an hour) but it was sharks and not pirates that worried me.
and how many here fish mexico, guatemala, belize, etc etc or shoot birds in bolivia.
its a big world out there full of all kinds of great opportunities. does that mean you should go trekking in afghanistan? no .
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