Repower has Begun - B28

[PaulJ]

After 4 months of planning, studying and buying stuff, the repower of my 1973 B28 - PALADIN - begins! Plan is to have it worthy of float by the first week of May.

Thanksgiving weekend I took her out on a nice run around the S. FL ICW. Long story short... blew out my sbd engine when the remote oil filter line ruptured... alarms didn't work as they were not wired correctly by previous owner! After stewing on it for 2 months, I ordered new base engines (5.7L GM gassers) and have been reworking various parts and replacing parts as I get into it.

As of Sunday, I have a new stbd engine put together in my garage and the bulk of a new port engine ready. Will be heading to the yard on Wed for haul out and yank of both engines. Will be reworking the bildge and rewiring everything over the next month. Plan to drop in new engines first week of May.

Keep me in your thoughts and prayers.

PaulJ
“I'd much rather be a woman than a man. Women can cry, they can wear cute clothes, and they're the first to be rescued off sinking ships”
- Gilda Radner

[JeremyD]

I'll be watching your progress - Good luck

You doing a swap over? or going with FI 5.7's? Where did you get your 5.7's?

[CaptDana]

Good luck with the repower-
I have repowered my 28 4 times-- If you need any help or questions feel free to ask-- This is a great time to do the cosmetics-- clean up the wiring--bilge paint etc.

Also- Inspect your engine beds well-- My last repower I replaced mine-- for the final time--(original beds made it 34 years)

Feel free to contact me with any questions --
Thanks
Capt Dana
616-638-6145

[Kevin]

It sounds like you will have your hands full for a while. I always found if I estimated the timeline for a project on the boat or the car that I was wrong. Now If I think I can complete something in a month I know it will take 2 months. Thats just me though. We are all here to help even if it is just moral support. Good luck and post pictures if you can.

[JeremyD]

my personal formula is figure out what I think it will cost - then double it.

then figure out how long it will take and triple it - I'm pretty bad about "while I'm in there"...

[Brewster Minton]

I hope you get r done that quick but Kevin and Jeremy are right. Good luck and if we can help yell.

[PaulJ]

Thanks for the words of encouragement and warning. I found out early in the process to double the budget. I tore down the stbd engine in Jan/Feb and began taking parts in to be machined and inspected. Long story short, had to buy several new items I thought I could reuse. Other "unknowns" yet to be found.

Had a nice slow run 5 miles to Cracker Boys in Ft. Pierce on Wednesday. Had my 17 son with me... nice to spend quality time with him. Pulled the boat around noon on Wed and started disconnecting both endines. Wow, 17 yr olds can get a lot done compared to a tired old fat guy. He jumped around that bilge like a pro, disconnecting the shafts, motor mounts, hoses and wiring. I just kept him fed and watered!

Had the props pulled to be balanced and replacement of the cutless bearings. Unknown issue #1. Port side strut has a slight twist in it. turning slightly inward putting pressure on the outboard side of the forward end and pressue slightly inboard on the stern side. Will be trying to straighten it without removing it from the boat. If not, will have to pull it to put it on a press.

Pulled the engines on Thursday. Drove them over to Transmissions Marine Inc and pulled the trannys and dropped them off for complete rebuild. On the drive back home with two engines strapped down on U-Haul trailer, had a blow-out on the trailer on I-95. U-Haul guys were great and responded relatively quickly considering I was in no-mans-land on S. FL I-95. From time I called to having new tire on and back on the road only took 3 hours!!!!! Got back home around 11pm dog dead tired.

Friday, 17 yr old showed his stuff again... with me acting as a typical government inspector, I sat in my lawn chair in the garage and shouted out instructions and that kid tore down both engines in about 6 hours. Was able to take all my remaining parts to the machine shop for rework and testing by 4pm... should get them back next week.

Next weekend I will be starting on the bilge. Plan to clean it out and rewire and rehose while I'm in there. Will be replacing sister stringers and painting.

For now, it's Easter and my 20 yr old daughter's birthday. Have to take a couple of days to do the family thing.

[John F.]

Paul-

I'd like to hear some details on what you're able to reuse and how the GM base engines work out. My 454s just turned 31 years old.

John

[JeremyD]

Did you go for anymore power - or just standard 5.7 260 HP?

[PaulJ]

I did a lot of studying on the issue and weighing my options. Port engine was ok, but both engines had about 1300 hours on them and were 15 years old. I put 700 hours on them in 4 years! Had little problems with them, mainly the electrical stuff... distributor, coil, starters as they rust out pretty quickly. Also, the port engine sister stringer has some rot. I have been nursing it along with some get rot and epoxy. Given I was going to put new engine in stbd and pull port to replace sister stringer, I decided I would just do them both. Besides, the bride said I should do both and "be done with it."

I looked into new Mercs and Crusaders. Got schematics from dealers and did a lot a measuring. Newer engines are taller and would not be a direct fit. My 1973 B28 would have required the upper cockpit deck to be raised to fit new engines, something I have read several people do. I did not want to get into all of that for several reasons, including expense.

I looked at several marine base engine distributors and got quotes from several different companies. I went with Michigan Motorz as they sold NEW GM engines, complete with all tin, stanless water pump, marine oil pan, flywheel, torsion damper, etc. The block casting numbers show that the block was casted in Feb 2008... so they have got to be brandy-new. They are pre-vortec applications, so they are the same size engines as what I am removing. They are GM 350 V8 1987-1995 direct replacements. Per spec sheet, they are rated 270hp. See http://www.michiganmotorz.com/. So far, everything has gone as expected. They come with a 1 yr warranty. You'll see they are a pretty darn good deal. With delivery to my residential address, they were about $6,400 for the pair.

I am reusing all of my pullys, brackets, motor mounts, flywheel housing,. intake manifolds and most of my closed cooling systems. I have taken all of the iron to my local machine shop and had them baked, blasted and pressure tested. I took my heat exchangers to my local radiator shop (old buddy) and he tanked them and pressure tested and beefed up the welds. Had to trash one heat exchanger and buy new as the bundle had a pin-hole leak.

I had just rebuilt (2007) my distributors, new coil, wires, etc. so I am just reusing those. I bought 2 new starters and had planned to replace the old ones this year, so those are still in the box.

I bought 2 new alternators, all new hoses, belts, gaskets, etc. all Quicksilver (Merc) parts. Rebuilt my Rochester Quadrajet Carbs, fuel pump and sea water pumps. The complete set of hoses, gaskets, alternators and various odds-and-end parts were about $1,900.

I put 2 sets of new risers on last September, one month before I blew the stbd engine. They still look shiny as I only have about 20 hours on them. I've cleaned them up and checked them out... will reuse them. I typically swap them out every 3yrs regardless as they are the only iron raw water passes through.... better safe than sorry.

For the engines, I'll be right around $9,000 for the pair, reusing my exhaust manifolds and 3 of 4 heat exchangers and rebuild of my carbs.

Took my Velvet Drives which were working just fine to be rebuilt. This cost will be my biggest unknown. Will know better this week once they crack them open and see what parts need to be replaced. I budgeted $2K for the rebuilds, but as advised will expect ~$4K.

[Kevin]

Wow it sure sounds like you have a plan. I hope you get it done in your time frame. I did the same thing with my velvet drives when I first got my boat. Guy in town tore em apart and sure enough they needed nothing. He put them back together with new seal kits and I did not spend much. This guy is one of those really cool oldshool mechanics who takes these things apart and re-assembles while on a break from another project. You really do not find mechanics like him anymore!

[JeremyD]

How you liking those Styrs Kevin? I saw your boat on the Horizon Diesel website - (I am assuming that's your boat - engines and year matched) and it came out beautiful. I love awlgrip - one of the better paints of all time.

[scot]

John said:

My 454s just turned 31 years old.

I am hereby officially impressed.

[PaulJ]

Great news yesterday. I took both my Velvet Drives to Transmission Marine Inc (TMI) last Thursday to have them checked out and rebuilt. Got a call from them yesterday and they said both trannys were in relatively good shape and would not require much. They are rebuilding and including all new hoses, neutral switch, temp sensor, seals, etc. Cost is right at my budget, so no surprises there. They are also cleaning up and painting my motor mounts and linkage. They'll be ready early next week!

I should have both engines ready to drop in first week of May as long as the weather holds out.

Paul J.
1973 B28 - PALADIN

[JeremyD]

Excellent news!

[Preston Burrows]

Paul:

Your re-power brings back memories of mine in 2004/2005..............I went the same path as you except having a Fort Lauderdale based outfit piece the new engines together for me and then ship them to me in drop in condition,along with re-build kits for my BW 71C transmissions.......after considering about every other re-power option....

How are you dealing with the wiring harness? I had both new engines pre-wired with the same style Merc 10 pin connector and just plugged in.......

What about your engine mounting brackets including the trunnions ? Can you re-use all of yours ? I was able to re-use all of mine except one of the front engine mounting brackets which the Fort Lauderdale outfit was able to find for me used in good condition.....Merc p/n 71128A2.......the old one had 'self fused' to the engine block over its 23 years in place.......

If you know an aftermarket supplier of the pulleys for the seawater pump,same style/diameter as the Merc 'original' p/n 73798A1, let me know as OEM's are $300 + list price ! I've been thinking of installing a crank driven seawater pump on the starboard engine instead of the existing belt driven seawater pump so as to allow easier access to it...........

As far as I have found all GM 350 cid engines will fit all model year B28's......it's the intake manifold and fuel delivery system that makes the difference fit wise in terms of height,whether hi-rise intakes with carbs,efi, tbi etc.........variations are in the placement of the engines - those that are installed further forward give less 'tolerance' height wise...............all things being equal if your shafts are more than 63" long height tolerance under the engine hatches is minimal.......

[PaulJ]

I am able to reuse most everything including engine mounts. Took them to machine shop to be blasted and painted. I unwrapped the wiring harness, inspected and replaced anything suspicious and will reuse with the same plug. For the pulleys and such, I had them blasted and treated everything with Ospho and then painted them. They look like they just came out of the box.

Basically I decided that if it was made of rubber, was electrical or had a moving part in it, I would either replace with new or rebuild per spec to new. For all but a very few items, I have gone with direct Mercruiser/Quicksilver parts. I have a source here in town that has even been able to dig up parts listed as NLA from their inventory. Amazing to go back in the bowels of their large shop and dig into shelves and filing cabinets and pull out parts (like an intake manifold) that are brand new and been sitting in inventory for 10 or 20 years. I get good prices too!

As for height clearance, you are exactly right. The base 350 is relatively unchanged over the past 35-40 years. The difference is in the fuel delivery system. If you want more HP and fuel economy then you have to go with the newer high volume intakes and fuel injection. That adds just enough height on the base 350 to require the upper deck to be raised. By going "old-school" I don't have to change any running gear or raise the deck... I have to be budget concious... 1 kid in college and 1 about to go to college.... and I thought boats were expensive!!!!

The biggest advantage of staying with the same engines and doing the entire build myself, I will know what I have and when/how it was done. I will be able to monitor maintenance on a schedule and will be able to do it myself.

[scooter28]

i know you're doing it on a budget but i was able to go with efi and not have to modify the deck. I might have lost a few hp by doing it the way i did but would've had to do the same thing with carbs so i said screw it. lol

and i also was able to do it using hurth gears with 8deg down angle

[PaulJ]

Picked up my transmissions this weekend... literally. Darn things are pretty heavy. Boy they look nice! Great guys at TMI. They set me up with everything and even took time to go through installation and startup procedures.

Spent ALL DAY in the bilge. You can get a lot done when you start at 5:30am and work until sunset! It's hard to believe that with the engines out, there are still some hard places to reach. Guess it doesn't help that I'm getting old and fat!

Question for ya'll... what is the recommended product for degreasing the bilge to prep for paint? I spent a couple of hours scrubbing, rinsing and scraping one side of the bilge, but 36 years of sludge is a b!t@h to get up! I still have the other engine bay and the very bottom of the bilge to clean and prep for painting.

Took me a good 2 hours to get the old sister stringers out. The guy next to me in the boat yard thought I was going to come through the hull with all the pounding. The through bolts on the sisters were rusted through and I just snapped the bolt heads off. Pounded them out with a 3lb hammer. Not sure if Bertram used some sort of bonding compound like 5200, but those stringers were glued hard to the structure. I ended up pounding and crow baring them off and then scraping the wood off of the fiberglass where the boding wouldn't let go.

Another question... I have green patina on my thru hull fittings for my sea strainers. Any trick to cleaning them up to look fresh. Shame to have the bilge all shiny with new engines and old green bronze fittings in the middle.

Paul J.
1973 B28 - PALADIN

[PaulJ]

Installing engines today!

Well... I'm 6 weeks behind my originally planned schedule, but it's finally ready. Kevin was right... planned for 5 weeks... took more like 12. Four major reasons:
1) Work... several items came up and I was unable to take the time off that I had originally planned.
2) Family... while we "discuss" the issue, my wife reminds me that she and the kids take priority over the boat.
3) Weather... it rained cats & dogs here in May. I had to make emergency runs down to the yard to hot-wire batteries which had been removed to the bilge pumps. Darn thing was a swimming pool which resulted in me having to do some clean-up after the fact.
4) Just harder than I thought... It took me many more hours to prep the bilge than I thought. Replaced all of the sister stringers, new battery shelves, rewired and replumbed everything, new fire suppression, etc. Coupled with the heat of late May and June in Florida, I could only stand working in the bilge until early afternoons before I was totally exhausted.

I am jealous of the guy next to me in the yard who is also working his bilge on his 42 Hat. He brought in a 10-Ton AC unit and has it sitting on saw horses with flex ducting running into the cabin and bilge.

Hope to splash this weekend.

PaulJ
1973 B28 - Paladin