2021 Cummins options
Moderators: CaptPatrick, mike ohlstein, Bruce
-
- Senior Member
- Posts: 7027
- Joined: Jun 29th, '06, 21:24
- Location: Hillsdale, New Jersey
- Contact:
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Stephan
Yep the old big blocks were pretty easy to work on. I do not miss the fogging process for winterization. I used to poor fogging oil down the carb then pull each plug and shoot fogging oil in them. Had one of those little plastic straws from the can come off into the engine one time. Could not get it out. Believe it or not, Started up in the spring and it never missed a beat. I figure it melted and blew out on the first shot.
Now with the diesels, run antifreeze thru them, spray them down and done.
The Mechanical Cummins are easy to work on. I would say, out side of the weight difference on some parts, it is pretty easy to pull them apart.
Yep the old big blocks were pretty easy to work on. I do not miss the fogging process for winterization. I used to poor fogging oil down the carb then pull each plug and shoot fogging oil in them. Had one of those little plastic straws from the can come off into the engine one time. Could not get it out. Believe it or not, Started up in the spring and it never missed a beat. I figure it melted and blew out on the first shot.
Now with the diesels, run antifreeze thru them, spray them down and done.
The Mechanical Cummins are easy to work on. I would say, out side of the weight difference on some parts, it is pretty easy to pull them apart.
1975 FBC BERG1467-315
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Peter i repowered my bahia mar in 2018 put in 270 remans done by forked river diesel .same guys who did tony's. i get an honest 25 knot cruise at 2250 rpms. i would try giving John Lane a call
Re: 2021 Cummins options
A couple of saddle tanks for sale ---if anybody needs some range----not affiliated with this listing.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/114702758908
https://www.ebay.com/itm/114702758908
- PeterPalmieri
- Senior Member
- Posts: 2612
- Joined: Nov 12th, '10, 11:26
- Location: Babylon, NY
Re: 2021 Cummins options
I’m planning on doing the repower at the end of the season.
My decision is really should I keep it as low maintenance as possible and go with the 220s? Or consider 270/330/QSB
I want to basically do everything under the hood;
Deck supports
Rudder shelf
Rudders
Strut back pads
Exhaust
Maybe the tank
Move batteries to center line
Move black water tank to starboard side
The next question, Mike O recommended Dickson’s in Bayshore and I want local service. My current mechanic comes to me when necessary. Anyone else local to Babylon that I should consider.
Should I plan on having a yard do all the work or am I better off having Raybo gut and do all the glass, supports etc and someone separate to install engines?
The only work I plan on doing is dropping the boat off, taking lots of pictures and writing a check.
My decision is really should I keep it as low maintenance as possible and go with the 220s? Or consider 270/330/QSB
I want to basically do everything under the hood;
Deck supports
Rudder shelf
Rudders
Strut back pads
Exhaust
Maybe the tank
Move batteries to center line
Move black water tank to starboard side
The next question, Mike O recommended Dickson’s in Bayshore and I want local service. My current mechanic comes to me when necessary. Anyone else local to Babylon that I should consider.
Should I plan on having a yard do all the work or am I better off having Raybo gut and do all the glass, supports etc and someone separate to install engines?
The only work I plan on doing is dropping the boat off, taking lots of pictures and writing a check.
1969 31 Bertram FBC "East Wind" hull #315939
-
- Senior Member
- Posts: 7027
- Joined: Jun 29th, '06, 21:24
- Location: Hillsdale, New Jersey
- Contact:
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Peter
When I did mine, Forked River Diesel had the boat and did the engine install. I had a separate person do the glass work. The person that did the glass work was actually mobile which many of them are, and he would come to the boat to work on any glass work that was needed. While it was my glass guy, Forked River Diesel coordinate the work with him.
It worked out well, but the glass guy I used would show up when he said he would and if something happened and he could not make it, he made sure he called Forked River Diesel to notify them.
The advantage I had was that Forked River Diesel's shop is located at a large Marina.
I would talk with Raybo and others to see how they would handle the job.
When I did mine, Forked River Diesel had the boat and did the engine install. I had a separate person do the glass work. The person that did the glass work was actually mobile which many of them are, and he would come to the boat to work on any glass work that was needed. While it was my glass guy, Forked River Diesel coordinate the work with him.
It worked out well, but the glass guy I used would show up when he said he would and if something happened and he could not make it, he made sure he called Forked River Diesel to notify them.
The advantage I had was that Forked River Diesel's shop is located at a large Marina.
I would talk with Raybo and others to see how they would handle the job.
1975 FBC BERG1467-315
- PeterPalmieri
- Senior Member
- Posts: 2612
- Joined: Nov 12th, '10, 11:26
- Location: Babylon, NY
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Thanks Tony I appreciate the advice, Rob at Raybo supports us here, he’s a local business owner and has done work for me. Hopefully he sees this otherwise I’ll reach out.
Pete
Pete
1969 31 Bertram FBC "East Wind" hull #315939
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Peter---if the boat is in the water---you are probably better off to drop it off at Dickson's ---let them pull the motors and whatever else that can be done----then truck it over to Raybo for their work. You will probably have to transport it back to Dickson's for the engine install.
Re: 2021 Cummins options
PeterPalmieri wrote: ↑Mar 10th, '21, 20:14
The only work I plan on doing is ......................... writing a check.
That is a HELL of ALOT of work right there!!
If your going 330 or QSB's your also doing shafts, couplings, props, packing box and possibly shaft log.
..and you forgot engine beds.
Batteries n cables, filters...
With those motor choices, I don't think you can go wrong.
As your going new soup to nuts...my .02 is collect all the quotes. Adjust up several factors for overruns in both cost and time. Then take a look and see what could be a Turnkey Boat alternative in that price range. Still opting for your 31 conversion, I'm behind you all the way!
If you did that already... Great, I'm happy for you, can't wait to see it done.
-
- Senior Member
- Posts: 7027
- Joined: Jun 29th, '06, 21:24
- Location: Hillsdale, New Jersey
- Contact:
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Carl
So what you are saying to Peter is, figure on selling a gas boat for $30,000. That puts $30,000 in your pocket. Then figure on putting $90,000 into her between engines and glass work, so you are out of pocket $60,000. The question becomes what kind of 31 can you buy for $60,000. Or if you planned on spending $90,000. what kind of 31 can you buy for $90,000.
So what you are saying to Peter is, figure on selling a gas boat for $30,000. That puts $30,000 in your pocket. Then figure on putting $90,000 into her between engines and glass work, so you are out of pocket $60,000. The question becomes what kind of 31 can you buy for $60,000. Or if you planned on spending $90,000. what kind of 31 can you buy for $90,000.
1975 FBC BERG1467-315
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Tony-
Close...using your numbers, sell the boat for 30k then add the 90k for refit. That gives 120k to buy a done boat.
As you inquired..what kind of 31 can you buy for 120k? I'd say there are some good options in that range.
Of course if the need, want and ability is to finish the transformation of what you have to make you and your family smile...then that is a different story and makes sense to put the money into the boat you have.
Close...using your numbers, sell the boat for 30k then add the 90k for refit. That gives 120k to buy a done boat.
As you inquired..what kind of 31 can you buy for 120k? I'd say there are some good options in that range.
Of course if the need, want and ability is to finish the transformation of what you have to make you and your family smile...then that is a different story and makes sense to put the money into the boat you have.
Last edited by Carl on Mar 12th, '21, 06:46, edited 1 time in total.
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Carl,
I understand your point and it opens up the options. But there is something to be said for new motors with warranties and knowing the history and the upkeep of those motors. There is a good chance they’ll outlast Pete and his boys will be running them one day.
No matter how clean the used ‘already done’ boat options are, you still have the unknowns and the what ifs.
I’m in the same boat right now. My offshore boat has been on blocks for almost a decade as I built a fishing cabin on a barrier island with some buddies and all my fishing/boating was on that bay for the last 8 or so years. But I sold out of the fishing cabin and the offshore boat is about to come back to life. I’ve looked at all the options I could think about. New (remanufactured) Cummins 6BTs, fixing up my Frankenstein Cummins 24v 6BTs, or selling the boat and buying someone else’s rehabbed boat. While I like the option Pete is going with, I’ll probably fix up my 24v Cummins and run that boat. So far buying the ‘done’ boat hasn’t been the top choice, but if I run across the ‘right’ one before I pull the trigger on options A or B it still might happen.
Good luck with the repower Pete. Glad you’re getting to the point where you are comfortable pulling the trigger. I’m still at the analysis paralysis stage.
I understand your point and it opens up the options. But there is something to be said for new motors with warranties and knowing the history and the upkeep of those motors. There is a good chance they’ll outlast Pete and his boys will be running them one day.
No matter how clean the used ‘already done’ boat options are, you still have the unknowns and the what ifs.
I’m in the same boat right now. My offshore boat has been on blocks for almost a decade as I built a fishing cabin on a barrier island with some buddies and all my fishing/boating was on that bay for the last 8 or so years. But I sold out of the fishing cabin and the offshore boat is about to come back to life. I’ve looked at all the options I could think about. New (remanufactured) Cummins 6BTs, fixing up my Frankenstein Cummins 24v 6BTs, or selling the boat and buying someone else’s rehabbed boat. While I like the option Pete is going with, I’ll probably fix up my 24v Cummins and run that boat. So far buying the ‘done’ boat hasn’t been the top choice, but if I run across the ‘right’ one before I pull the trigger on options A or B it still might happen.
Good luck with the repower Pete. Glad you’re getting to the point where you are comfortable pulling the trigger. I’m still at the analysis paralysis stage.
- PeterPalmieri
- Senior Member
- Posts: 2612
- Joined: Nov 12th, '10, 11:26
- Location: Babylon, NY
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Great advice guys, while I’d like to have a higher cruise, to do everything else right, in terms of the scope beyond the engines I think sticker shock will keep me focused on the 220s. That remains to be seen.
I recognize I could sell my boat and buy a redone diesel for cheaper than I can repower but as Daniel said there is a lot to be said for knowing what work was done, the quality of that work and the maintenance that has happened since.
Of course if the right boat popped up that’s a different story but as of now the price of boats that seem to have all of this done the right way are through the roof.
We will see as of now there are only a few on the market like Tobasco where they are asking over 200k that check enough boxes or the one finished by Wortons which I think they’re asking 3. I’m not in that league.
I recognize I could sell my boat and buy a redone diesel for cheaper than I can repower but as Daniel said there is a lot to be said for knowing what work was done, the quality of that work and the maintenance that has happened since.
Of course if the right boat popped up that’s a different story but as of now the price of boats that seem to have all of this done the right way are through the roof.
We will see as of now there are only a few on the market like Tobasco where they are asking over 200k that check enough boxes or the one finished by Wortons which I think they’re asking 3. I’m not in that league.
1969 31 Bertram FBC "East Wind" hull #315939
- PeterPalmieri
- Senior Member
- Posts: 2612
- Joined: Nov 12th, '10, 11:26
- Location: Babylon, NY
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Poking around boat trader and yacht world.
Sure you can find some nice boats for 120k with 2006 yanmars. With a glassed in windshield which is a deal killer for my family.
Cummins 250s with nice cosmetic upgrades 140k with glasses in windows.
Show me a recent repower with all the important under hood things. That’s the same cost as what I have to lay out and what I could sell my boat for. I’ve looked at every boat that’s been for sale and I don’t see it. I see nice boats for 200k. Or decent boats with off brand diesels or suspect work.
I’m not opposed to that route. I just haven’t come across a boat that checks all the boxes that’s cost is in line with a repower and selling my boat.
Sure you can find some nice boats for 120k with 2006 yanmars. With a glassed in windshield which is a deal killer for my family.
Cummins 250s with nice cosmetic upgrades 140k with glasses in windows.
Show me a recent repower with all the important under hood things. That’s the same cost as what I have to lay out and what I could sell my boat for. I’ve looked at every boat that’s been for sale and I don’t see it. I see nice boats for 200k. Or decent boats with off brand diesels or suspect work.
I’m not opposed to that route. I just haven’t come across a boat that checks all the boxes that’s cost is in line with a repower and selling my boat.
1969 31 Bertram FBC "East Wind" hull #315939
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Pete,
The only real FAMILY boat that checks all boxes is a 28.
Preferably with 240 Yanmars.
The only real FAMILY boat that checks all boxes is a 28.
Preferably with 240 Yanmars.
1973 B28 FBC/2007 4LHA STP's - "Phantom Duck" - Hull "BER 00794 1172"
Re: 2021 Cummins options
i know a guy who has some 210s for sale
wink!!!
wink!!!
-
- Senior Member
- Posts: 173
- Joined: Aug 3rd, '06, 16:39
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Hi Pete,
I can only speak for myself but I think the money is well spent upgrading to the 330s or the qsbs. After running 2 different 31 bertram bahia mars. one with a 22 to 24 knot cruise and the other with a 28 to 30 knot cruise I can tell you that the 31 bertram is an excellent running boat at 26 knots. My Dad's current boat has 300 hp cummins and is super heavy which completely changes the ride hence the 22 to 24 knot cruise but the boat is a tank in any sea condition. The previous boat named Priceless had 315 yanmars was super light and was much more tender in a rough ocean but ran like a scalded cat up to 34 knots. It was nice to have the extra power when you wanted to run to the canyon on those flat calm days to do a day trip. I remember running home from the spencer canyon to indian river inlet delaware over 100 miles at 28 knots and it made that long run bearable. I also fished a good amount on Brewsters boat which had 315 yanmars and that boat cruised all day at 26 knots in some crappy conditions because it was also heavier than most.
Best Regards,
Chris
I can only speak for myself but I think the money is well spent upgrading to the 330s or the qsbs. After running 2 different 31 bertram bahia mars. one with a 22 to 24 knot cruise and the other with a 28 to 30 knot cruise I can tell you that the 31 bertram is an excellent running boat at 26 knots. My Dad's current boat has 300 hp cummins and is super heavy which completely changes the ride hence the 22 to 24 knot cruise but the boat is a tank in any sea condition. The previous boat named Priceless had 315 yanmars was super light and was much more tender in a rough ocean but ran like a scalded cat up to 34 knots. It was nice to have the extra power when you wanted to run to the canyon on those flat calm days to do a day trip. I remember running home from the spencer canyon to indian river inlet delaware over 100 miles at 28 knots and it made that long run bearable. I also fished a good amount on Brewsters boat which had 315 yanmars and that boat cruised all day at 26 knots in some crappy conditions because it was also heavier than most.
Best Regards,
Chris
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Pete,
I’ve been looking as well and I can’t remember how many times I’ve seen adds that state a boat had NEW Cummins or Yanmars installed in 2001 or 2003…and they listed that as a selling point…..well OK… I understand the reliability of good quality diesels, but 20 years in a boat is 20 years in a boat. I just thought that was funny.
I haven’t gotten recent quotes but in 2019 I talked with the Houston Cummins dealer and came in about 22.5k per side on a repower option for 315/330 hp. 2 year 2000 hour warrantee, 30’ wiring panel, mounts, flywheel, Basically a drop in engine. That was me coming in and bringing him my core in a box and him handing me a drop in engine in a box and me taking care of installation. We never talked about post install check out, but it would have to be done to get the warrantee. They weren’t all that comfortable selling to an individual as most of their work was with the yards but it seemed like he would do it. I was planning on contracting the install out in my man cave/shop because that’s where the boat is and I have access to the equipment to set the motors. So that price was cash and carry.
I asked about 270 hp and he didn’t have a quote for them I can’t remember why, but he didn’t have an option for that. I think he said he didn’t sell many as most folks were wanting the 315/330. I never asked about 220 hp.
Of course that’s 2 years ago I’m sure things have changed since then. If you don’t mind I’d like to PM you my cell and talk with you about the current pricing you’re seeing in the NE.
I’ve been looking as well and I can’t remember how many times I’ve seen adds that state a boat had NEW Cummins or Yanmars installed in 2001 or 2003…and they listed that as a selling point…..well OK… I understand the reliability of good quality diesels, but 20 years in a boat is 20 years in a boat. I just thought that was funny.
I haven’t gotten recent quotes but in 2019 I talked with the Houston Cummins dealer and came in about 22.5k per side on a repower option for 315/330 hp. 2 year 2000 hour warrantee, 30’ wiring panel, mounts, flywheel, Basically a drop in engine. That was me coming in and bringing him my core in a box and him handing me a drop in engine in a box and me taking care of installation. We never talked about post install check out, but it would have to be done to get the warrantee. They weren’t all that comfortable selling to an individual as most of their work was with the yards but it seemed like he would do it. I was planning on contracting the install out in my man cave/shop because that’s where the boat is and I have access to the equipment to set the motors. So that price was cash and carry.
I asked about 270 hp and he didn’t have a quote for them I can’t remember why, but he didn’t have an option for that. I think he said he didn’t sell many as most folks were wanting the 315/330. I never asked about 220 hp.
Of course that’s 2 years ago I’m sure things have changed since then. If you don’t mind I’d like to PM you my cell and talk with you about the current pricing you’re seeing in the NE.
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Peter, glad to see you looked to see what options could be had for the amount of coin being laid out. I do not think either is a better or worse choice...I think its just good to know the options especially prior to laying down the coin and signing paperwork.
It's a boat...it has to get you where your going and back safely everything else is icing on the cake.
It's a boat...it has to get you where your going and back safely everything else is icing on the cake.
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Daniel-
The numbers of my motors said they were 24volt motors. I guess that got changed as they are 12v. If they were indeed still 24 volt my intention was to convert. SB marine sells the harness and the starter alternator guy told me it wasn't a big deal to change. Not much electrical stuff on them.
The numbers of my motors said they were 24volt motors. I guess that got changed as they are 12v. If they were indeed still 24 volt my intention was to convert. SB marine sells the harness and the starter alternator guy told me it wasn't a big deal to change. Not much electrical stuff on them.
- PeterPalmieri
- Senior Member
- Posts: 2612
- Joined: Nov 12th, '10, 11:26
- Location: Babylon, NY
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Exactly Carl that’s why I have to prioritize all the less sexy items and if it means 220s I’m cool with that. If I can do everything that needs to get done and 330s that’s even better.Carl wrote: ↑Mar 12th, '21, 14:33 Peter, glad to see you looked to see what options could be had for the amount of coin being laid out. I do not think either is a better or worse choice...I think its just good to know the options especially prior to laying down the coin and signing paperwork.
It's a boat...it has to get you where your going and back safely everything else is icing on the cake.
1969 31 Bertram FBC "East Wind" hull #315939
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Carl,
I should have been more specific when I mentioned my “Frankenstein Cummins 24v 6BTs”. I have Cummins 6BTA engines in my Chris Craft 30’ Tournament Sport Fisherman but they say ‘DODGE’ on the valve covers. They are 2001/2002 24 valve engines out of Dodge trucks.
In the early 2000s I had couple friends with a business selling a marine conversion kit for Dodge 12 valve engines with the mechanical fuel pump. They had a well thought out and good quality kit, and had sold quite a few of the 12v kits with a fair amount of success on the conversion. At the time they wanted to start doing the same for the 24valve electronic engines. I was ready for repowering the TSF so I pulled the trigger on the kit. I was kind of the guinea pig on that, it was an adventure figuring them out. Eventually we got them dialed in and they ran pretty strong for a couple seasons until my fuel tank delaminated and that’s when the boat went up on blocks and life took a turn to the fishing cabin and bay fishing.
While I enjoyed the challenge of making them work 15 years ago, it was something I had be ok figuring out myself because the truck guys were lost outside of a truck and the marine guys would just shake their head and say “why the hell did you do that boy”. It was interesting getting past all the ECM/TPS/wiring harness issues. But 58 year old Danny is less likely to stay up late on a work night figuring it out and wrenching on the motors late at night than 43 year Danny was. I still like it, but it’s harder to get myself to do it. Also I’m in better position funds wise this go around.
So my options are
A. Fix them as is and deal with the electronics ECM/TPS/VP44 etc.
B. Pull them and swap out the electronic injection pump to a mechanical injection pump. I already have the mechanical injection pumps in hand
so the conversion is about 5k a motor
C. Pull the 24v motors and sell them to someone redoing a truck as the engines are very low hour and strong. Then buy marine Cummins and drop
them in. That’s why I was following Pete’s thread.
D. Sell the whole boat and buy an already done rehabbed boat. But the right boat hasn’t showed up yet.
I’m leaning toward B as it’s a common swap in the truck crowd and I’ll be back to the reliability of a full mechanical 6BTA. It’s easy to make stupid horse power with that set up, so somewhere north of 300hp and reliable is pretty doable.
I’m finishing up my last house rehab and it’s about to go on the market. Some of the funds from that are earmarked for boat work, so I’m starting to get excited about the boat again.
If you want to jump in the way-back machine, here is a link to when I rehabbed her the first time back in 2008. I went looking for the thread and was surprised to see the pictures still embedded.
http://bertram31.com/newbb/viewtopic.php?t=2489
I should have been more specific when I mentioned my “Frankenstein Cummins 24v 6BTs”. I have Cummins 6BTA engines in my Chris Craft 30’ Tournament Sport Fisherman but they say ‘DODGE’ on the valve covers. They are 2001/2002 24 valve engines out of Dodge trucks.
In the early 2000s I had couple friends with a business selling a marine conversion kit for Dodge 12 valve engines with the mechanical fuel pump. They had a well thought out and good quality kit, and had sold quite a few of the 12v kits with a fair amount of success on the conversion. At the time they wanted to start doing the same for the 24valve electronic engines. I was ready for repowering the TSF so I pulled the trigger on the kit. I was kind of the guinea pig on that, it was an adventure figuring them out. Eventually we got them dialed in and they ran pretty strong for a couple seasons until my fuel tank delaminated and that’s when the boat went up on blocks and life took a turn to the fishing cabin and bay fishing.
While I enjoyed the challenge of making them work 15 years ago, it was something I had be ok figuring out myself because the truck guys were lost outside of a truck and the marine guys would just shake their head and say “why the hell did you do that boy”. It was interesting getting past all the ECM/TPS/wiring harness issues. But 58 year old Danny is less likely to stay up late on a work night figuring it out and wrenching on the motors late at night than 43 year Danny was. I still like it, but it’s harder to get myself to do it. Also I’m in better position funds wise this go around.
So my options are
A. Fix them as is and deal with the electronics ECM/TPS/VP44 etc.
B. Pull them and swap out the electronic injection pump to a mechanical injection pump. I already have the mechanical injection pumps in hand
so the conversion is about 5k a motor
C. Pull the 24v motors and sell them to someone redoing a truck as the engines are very low hour and strong. Then buy marine Cummins and drop
them in. That’s why I was following Pete’s thread.
D. Sell the whole boat and buy an already done rehabbed boat. But the right boat hasn’t showed up yet.
I’m leaning toward B as it’s a common swap in the truck crowd and I’ll be back to the reliability of a full mechanical 6BTA. It’s easy to make stupid horse power with that set up, so somewhere north of 300hp and reliable is pretty doable.
I’m finishing up my last house rehab and it’s about to go on the market. Some of the funds from that are earmarked for boat work, so I’m starting to get excited about the boat again.
If you want to jump in the way-back machine, here is a link to when I rehabbed her the first time back in 2008. I went looking for the thread and was surprised to see the pictures still embedded.
http://bertram31.com/newbb/viewtopic.php?t=2489
Re: 2021 Cummins options
What a beautiful boat, Danny, a Napier design I think.
Do you have any inside pics?
Do you have any inside pics?
1973 B28 FBC/2007 4LHA STP's - "Phantom Duck" - Hull "BER 00794 1172"
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Daniel- now I get what you mean by Frankenstein motors.
Dabbling is fun when you have the time,energy and the will. I have gotten past that point.
Dabbling is fun when you have the time,energy and the will. I have gotten past that point.
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Pete, call Skip Helme and ask him about Wahine. If you are going to buy one already done, she should be the one. Its a beautiful example of a 31. Twin 250 Cummins, forward windows, Ns really, really clean. Www.BSBW.com. Or his office # is:401-847-0321 and his wife Nancy may answer the phone. Please tell him I suggested you call. He’s been back and forth on selling, but he would be really happy to know it would be. A buyer who loves the boat like you would.
If you want one already done.
Hope you and the family are well!
Dug
If you want one already done.
Hope you and the family are well!
Dug
Re: 2021 Cummins options
DanielM I have a friend who turned one of those into an express. F’ing GORGEOUS lines!!!!!! Nice boat my friend!
- PeterPalmieri
- Senior Member
- Posts: 2612
- Joined: Nov 12th, '10, 11:26
- Location: Babylon, NY
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Thanks Dug, does it have a glasses in front windshield? That’s a deal breaker.Dug wrote: ↑Mar 13th, '21, 16:45 Pete, call Skip Helme and ask him about Wahine. If you are going to buy one already done, she should be the one. Its a beautiful example of a 31. Twin 250 Cummins, forward windows, Ns really, really clean. Www.BSBW.com. Or his office # is:401-847-0321 and his wife Nancy may answer the phone. Please tell him I suggested you call. He’s been back and forth on selling, but he would be really happy to know it would be. A buyer who loves the boat like you would.
If you want one already done.
Hope you and the family are well!
Dug
1969 31 Bertram FBC "East Wind" hull #315939
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Yannis,
Thank you, she is and was a good looking boat, she is kind of forlorn looking now, but I’m looking forward to round 2 on her. Not the iconic lines of the B31 but not a bad looking boat.
I don’t have any inside pics handy. Most of what I used to like to do revolved around being in the cockpit. Diving mainly and fishing some. So the cabin was never ‘niced up’. It’s pretty sparse, but they can be very nice. A lot of teak.
Not a Napier, it’s a Ray Hunt design. Chris Craft made them from 1975-1978. The hull is very similar to the Bertram 31. So similar in fact that Bertram sued Chris Craft for patent infringement due to the similarities with the B31 hull and won. Chris Craft made about 172 hulls before Bertram made them quit. Mine is hull #009.
Dug,
Is your friend Gregg (Thumbs Up)? if so I recently talked with him and saw some pictures of the finished product. He built an awesome express. It turned out incredible looking. If not I’d be interested in learning more. I remember talking with you after your friend Gil passed. Gil was ’the man’ on those CC30 TSF models. He helped me some back in the day.
Pete,
Sorry for the thread derail. I don’t see how you could go wrong starting next season with a boat you know, the family enjoys, and new Cummins engines that, based on history, are about as trouble free as a marine product can be.
Good luck with the new motors.
Thank you, she is and was a good looking boat, she is kind of forlorn looking now, but I’m looking forward to round 2 on her. Not the iconic lines of the B31 but not a bad looking boat.
I don’t have any inside pics handy. Most of what I used to like to do revolved around being in the cockpit. Diving mainly and fishing some. So the cabin was never ‘niced up’. It’s pretty sparse, but they can be very nice. A lot of teak.
Not a Napier, it’s a Ray Hunt design. Chris Craft made them from 1975-1978. The hull is very similar to the Bertram 31. So similar in fact that Bertram sued Chris Craft for patent infringement due to the similarities with the B31 hull and won. Chris Craft made about 172 hulls before Bertram made them quit. Mine is hull #009.
Dug,
Is your friend Gregg (Thumbs Up)? if so I recently talked with him and saw some pictures of the finished product. He built an awesome express. It turned out incredible looking. If not I’d be interested in learning more. I remember talking with you after your friend Gil passed. Gil was ’the man’ on those CC30 TSF models. He helped me some back in the day.
Pete,
Sorry for the thread derail. I don’t see how you could go wrong starting next season with a boat you know, the family enjoys, and new Cummins engines that, based on history, are about as trouble free as a marine product can be.
Good luck with the new motors.
- PeterPalmieri
- Senior Member
- Posts: 2612
- Joined: Nov 12th, '10, 11:26
- Location: Babylon, NY
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Daniel, no worries about a derail, good conversation. A family a couple slips down from me had a 30 TSF. Great boat. Outside of the leaky aft bulk head she’s pretty bullet proof.
My wife and I have been working really hard the last bunch of years, making sure all our ducks are in a row. Being pretty frugal, saving for retirement, putting money away for the kids college etc. now that we have the resources to do this it’s pretty hard to let go of a large chunk of change for something that’s definitely not on the need list but is a big want.
My wife and I have been working really hard the last bunch of years, making sure all our ducks are in a row. Being pretty frugal, saving for retirement, putting money away for the kids college etc. now that we have the resources to do this it’s pretty hard to let go of a large chunk of change for something that’s definitely not on the need list but is a big want.
1969 31 Bertram FBC "East Wind" hull #315939
- PeterPalmieri
- Senior Member
- Posts: 2612
- Joined: Nov 12th, '10, 11:26
- Location: Babylon, NY
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Going to drop my opinion on options to buy a boat that’s done, feel free to beat me up.
Ideal boat, needs a head and the yanmars are 2006 135k
Look at this awesome Bertram I Found on BoatTrader! https://www.boattrader.com/boat/1982-be ... r-7620356/
Home run but I’d have to add windows and a lot of money
Look at this awesome Bertram I Found on BoatTrader! https://www.boattrader.com/boat/1978-be ... r-7567308/
This seems to be the home run, but again glassed windshield 120k
Look at this awesome Bertram I Found on BoatTrader! https://www.boattrader.com/boat/1973-be ... r-7658996/
Perfect boat for me, I’d do a boat just like this and be 100% satisfied, a bit more fishing friendly in the pit. Don’t like the choice of engines
Look at this awesome Bertram I Found on BoatTrader! https://www.boattrader.com/boat/1963-be ... b-7417614/
This the one boat that is ready to go, wouldn’t change a thing. Big price tag and not sure how old the motors are. I think they’re yanmars 225k
Look at this awesome Bertram I Found on BoatTrader! https://www.boattrader.com/boat/1974-be ... r-7008063/
Low hours needs the top ripped off and a bunch done in the interior.
Look at this awesome Bertram I Found on BoatTrader! https://www.boattrader.com/boat/1961-be ... r-7415908/
Ideal boat, needs a head and the yanmars are 2006 135k
Look at this awesome Bertram I Found on BoatTrader! https://www.boattrader.com/boat/1982-be ... r-7620356/
Home run but I’d have to add windows and a lot of money
Look at this awesome Bertram I Found on BoatTrader! https://www.boattrader.com/boat/1978-be ... r-7567308/
This seems to be the home run, but again glassed windshield 120k
Look at this awesome Bertram I Found on BoatTrader! https://www.boattrader.com/boat/1973-be ... r-7658996/
Perfect boat for me, I’d do a boat just like this and be 100% satisfied, a bit more fishing friendly in the pit. Don’t like the choice of engines
Look at this awesome Bertram I Found on BoatTrader! https://www.boattrader.com/boat/1963-be ... b-7417614/
This the one boat that is ready to go, wouldn’t change a thing. Big price tag and not sure how old the motors are. I think they’re yanmars 225k
Look at this awesome Bertram I Found on BoatTrader! https://www.boattrader.com/boat/1974-be ... r-7008063/
Low hours needs the top ripped off and a bunch done in the interior.
Look at this awesome Bertram I Found on BoatTrader! https://www.boattrader.com/boat/1961-be ... r-7415908/
1969 31 Bertram FBC "East Wind" hull #315939
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Windshield is not, I repeat NOT glassed in!
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Daniel, yep, Greg’s the one!!! Sweet isn’t it?
And yes Gil was a very good friend. I miss him a lot. I am glad you guys connected back in the day. He loved his 30CC.
And yes Gil was a very good friend. I miss him a lot. I am glad you guys connected back in the day. He loved his 30CC.
- PeterPalmieri
- Senior Member
- Posts: 2612
- Joined: Nov 12th, '10, 11:26
- Location: Babylon, NY
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Thanks Dug I will reach out. It was recently up for sale in the last year around 120k?
1969 31 Bertram FBC "East Wind" hull #315939
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Isn't the Tabasco Mike O’s boat?
1973 B28 FBC/2007 4LHA STP's - "Phantom Duck" - Hull "BER 00794 1172"
- PeterPalmieri
- Senior Member
- Posts: 2612
- Joined: Nov 12th, '10, 11:26
- Location: Babylon, NY
Re: 2021 Cummins options
No but they have similar color hulls.
1969 31 Bertram FBC "East Wind" hull #315939
Re: 2021 Cummins options
I was thinking more of an apples to apples boat with newer power, not a fully done one. Especially not at those prices. But that is what "I" was thinking.PeterPalmieri wrote: ↑Mar 14th, '21, 08:20 Going to drop my opinion on options to buy a boat that’s done, feel free to beat me up.
Doing a new re-power/conversion is like buying a new car. You pay top dollar for driving it out of the showroom than value drops considerably. Or think of it this way...if after you had conversion, did all your underhood goodies and used the boat for a season Than you won the Mega-Ball Lottery and now looking to buy your dream boat....what would you sell the Bertram for? What would be a fair price.
- PeterPalmieri
- Senior Member
- Posts: 2612
- Joined: Nov 12th, '10, 11:26
- Location: Babylon, NY
Re: 2021 Cummins options
I agree Carl. A lot of boats look like mine and they dropped new engines in 10 years ago but didn’t do all the “ under the hood” upgrades that are just as important. The only ones that check those boxes seem to have all the cosmetic stuff done too.
Kids don’t love the idea of selling the boat, since we have so many memories on this one, they seem to rule the roost as you know or maybe they are echoing my own thoughts. We will see.
Either way the idea is to have new boat mechanically speaking without going broke.
Kids don’t love the idea of selling the boat, since we have so many memories on this one, they seem to rule the roost as you know or maybe they are echoing my own thoughts. We will see.
Either way the idea is to have new boat mechanically speaking without going broke.
1969 31 Bertram FBC "East Wind" hull #315939
-
- Senior Member
- Posts: 7027
- Joined: Jun 29th, '06, 21:24
- Location: Hillsdale, New Jersey
- Contact:
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Peter
Do what Carl and I did. We did not get supper crazy. I basically rebuilt mine from the engines back, along with wiring. Still slowly adding stuff. It works. Is she the show piece she was in 1975 when we purchased her, no. But does she do what I need it to do yes.
What I would like to do next is have the windows all redone. But that means taking it someone who can do that job the right way. If I can stop the leaking, then I can redo the cabin. My wife wants the front windows. So If I was to do it I would do what Gerry Santiago did. He had all new frames made and all the windows are fixed in place.
I have not opened ours in over 40 years, except for the rear bulkhead windows.
Do what Carl and I did. We did not get supper crazy. I basically rebuilt mine from the engines back, along with wiring. Still slowly adding stuff. It works. Is she the show piece she was in 1975 when we purchased her, no. But does she do what I need it to do yes.
What I would like to do next is have the windows all redone. But that means taking it someone who can do that job the right way. If I can stop the leaking, then I can redo the cabin. My wife wants the front windows. So If I was to do it I would do what Gerry Santiago did. He had all new frames made and all the windows are fixed in place.
I have not opened ours in over 40 years, except for the rear bulkhead windows.
1975 FBC BERG1467-315
- PeterPalmieri
- Senior Member
- Posts: 2612
- Joined: Nov 12th, '10, 11:26
- Location: Babylon, NY
Re: 2021 Cummins options
http://www.hightidemarine.cc/bertram-31.htm
Tony for me this is the best of both worlds, new fiberglass frame. Takes Captain Pats idea on Gerry’s boat to the next level. Windows are a deal breaker in my house, we’ve been on many 31s at rendezvous and on vacation with glassed in windshield. It’s a no go, might as well own an express boat without windows in the cabin
Tony for me this is the best of both worlds, new fiberglass frame. Takes Captain Pats idea on Gerry’s boat to the next level. Windows are a deal breaker in my house, we’ve been on many 31s at rendezvous and on vacation with glassed in windshield. It’s a no go, might as well own an express boat without windows in the cabin
1969 31 Bertram FBC "East Wind" hull #315939
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Sounds like you did all your homework and have a clear path Peter.
I don't agree on the emotional attachment to a boat as a reason for the project, but very much agree on knowing what you have. What was done and not done, buying another boat leaves potential to unearth new headaches.
Looks like now all you need to do is settle in on the right set of motors. A balancing act of enough thrill to keep everyone smiling with a price tag you can live with. Good luck and if I can be of any service, you know how to reach me.
I don't agree on the emotional attachment to a boat as a reason for the project, but very much agree on knowing what you have. What was done and not done, buying another boat leaves potential to unearth new headaches.
Looks like now all you need to do is settle in on the right set of motors. A balancing act of enough thrill to keep everyone smiling with a price tag you can live with. Good luck and if I can be of any service, you know how to reach me.
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Peter ---did you get any pricing on the fiberglass frames?----they look great.
- PeterPalmieri
- Senior Member
- Posts: 2612
- Joined: Nov 12th, '10, 11:26
- Location: Babylon, NY
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Carl I always value your advice and opinion, thank you.Carl wrote: ↑Mar 17th, '21, 07:07 Sounds like you did all your homework and have a clear path Peter.
I don't agree on the emotional attachment to a boat as a reason for the project, but very much agree on knowing what you have. What was done and not done, buying another boat leaves potential to unearth new headaches.
Looks like now all you need to do is settle in on the right set of motors. A balancing act of enough thrill to keep everyone smiling with a price tag you can live with. Good luck and if I can be of any service, you know how to reach me.
1969 31 Bertram FBC "East Wind" hull #315939
- PeterPalmieri
- Senior Member
- Posts: 2612
- Joined: Nov 12th, '10, 11:26
- Location: Babylon, NY
Re: 2021 Cummins options
I never priced it out I know Bobmx had it done a couple years back and I forget what the cost of the frames were, plus glass, fixed or opening. Plus the idea of either sending the boat down to Danny vs having it fit locally.
He’s pretty active on FB I’ll ask.
1969 31 Bertram FBC "East Wind" hull #315939
Re: 2021 Cummins options
I am no formal mechanic but I do have a story. Two years ago at the Tripple Tree Fly In in South Carolina, I was talking with a man from Indiana who had just retired and was planning on building a high tech experimental airplane. I asked what technical experience he had. He was the lead engineer for the development of the Cummins 6bt engine. The company told him to use the finest materials and engineering to create the best possible Diesel engine. Long story short, he did and was very proud of the product. He also said that engine saved Chrystler. (Dodge Ram pickup, I have had four). Wish I had videoed the conversation.
He also told me what DEF is made from.
John
He also told me what DEF is made from.
John
-
- Senior Member
- Posts: 7027
- Joined: Jun 29th, '06, 21:24
- Location: Hillsdale, New Jersey
- Contact:
Re: 2021 Cummins options
High Tide is not afraid to ask for a high number. I like the frames. Great idea. My question to Danny would be how well they support the bridge. Remember those aluminum frames hold up the front of the bridge.
I would suggest if timing was right, we could get a couple of guys who are interested in them, fly down, rent a truck and bring them up. The issue would be finding someone who would install them up here.
Peter, do one thing, and Ray Belanger had suggested calling Forked River Diesel to see what he has laying around the shop in engines. John the owner seems to always find great running take outs or finds good engines and makes them great again. For the heck of it, I would check to see if he has any line on good running 270's. That is what he put in Ray's boat.
Worth a shot. It is only in NJ and easy to get them to Long Island.
I would suggest if timing was right, we could get a couple of guys who are interested in them, fly down, rent a truck and bring them up. The issue would be finding someone who would install them up here.
Peter, do one thing, and Ray Belanger had suggested calling Forked River Diesel to see what he has laying around the shop in engines. John the owner seems to always find great running take outs or finds good engines and makes them great again. For the heck of it, I would check to see if he has any line on good running 270's. That is what he put in Ray's boat.
Worth a shot. It is only in NJ and easy to get them to Long Island.
1975 FBC BERG1467-315
- PeterPalmieri
- Senior Member
- Posts: 2612
- Joined: Nov 12th, '10, 11:26
- Location: Babylon, NY
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Danny got back to me, being respectful I asked if he minded me sharing it with the group. Just waiting to hear back.
1969 31 Bertram FBC "East Wind" hull #315939
-
- Posts: 747
- Joined: Jul 22nd, '17, 13:59
Re: 2021 Cummins options
The saddle tanks were sold before I got to them. I'd be interested in buying some if anyone has a pair.
Rick Ott
Carolina Reaper
Hull # Don't have a clue
Carolina Reaper
Hull # Don't have a clue
-
- Posts: 232
- Joined: Feb 6th, '18, 16:37
Re: 2021 Cummins options
A set was just taken out of a 31 at the yard where my boat Winters. Do not know the condition or if they are going to be re-used, saw them laying in the boat shed. Try to find out tomorrow and let you knowEarleyBird
-
- Posts: 747
- Joined: Jul 22nd, '17, 13:59
Re: 2021 Cummins options
ThanksEarleyBird wrote: ↑Mar 24th, '21, 16:53 A set was just taken out of a 31 at the yard where my boat Winters. Do not know the condition or if they are going to be re-used, saw them laying in the boat shed. Try to find out tomorrow and let you knowEarleyBird
Rick Ott
Carolina Reaper
Hull # Don't have a clue
Carolina Reaper
Hull # Don't have a clue
-
- Posts: 232
- Joined: Feb 6th, '18, 16:37
Re: 2021 Cummins options
Just spoke with the Owner, they’re yours. They are presently in the railway at Carver Boat in Point Pleasant, N.J. Naturally might want to do a pressure test. Glad to be of some help. Chat later going flounder fishing. EarleyBird
-
- Posts: 747
- Joined: Jul 22nd, '17, 13:59
Re: 2021 Cummins options
You are the Man! I'll send you a PM with my contact info.EarleyBird wrote: ↑Mar 25th, '21, 10:28 Just spoke with the Owner, they’re yours. They are presently in the railway at Carver Boat in Point Pleasant, N.J. Naturally might want to do a pressure test. Glad to be of some help. Chat later going flounder fishing. EarleyBird
Rick Ott
Carolina Reaper
Hull # Don't have a clue
Carolina Reaper
Hull # Don't have a clue
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: Grande and 67 guests