Expected Performance by HP?

[Yannis]

Hey, Pete,

The only thing this plotter doesn't do is fry potatoes...I read through the details...holy cow, no doubt I could circumnavigate the earth with it. Never thought it could do sooo many tasks.

I was hoping for soth in the 4-500$ range, well, I’ll bite the bullet if need be.
For the time being I have no gps, no vhf, a tiny compass hidden somewhere...I travel by view by daylight only...this new thing is going to be a huge upgrade for me...I wonder when the next sales period is!
Thanks.

[PeterPalmieri]

The Garmin echomap without a touchscreen or transducer will get you into that price range.

[sillverchevy]

A little late to the game, but here are some numbers on a 1970 FBC with cummins 210's.
2000 rpm-20kts
2200 rpm-22kts
2400 rpm-24kts
2600 rpm (wot) - 26.5-27 kts

[Tony Meola]

https://www.thegpsstore.com/Garmin-ECHO ... P6182.aspx

Yannis

Something like this. Jumping up in size just one inch jumps you up 200 dollars.

[Yannis]

Yes, Tony,

Only, I don't care about the transducer so if I could find one without, it could be even cheaper.

However, one thing that escaped me is that it appeared that size was the only decisive factor in the cost. Damn it, it’s also the touch screen...it’s so much better to not have to move the screen with that arrow button.

Interesting though that both Pete and you proposed a Garmin.

One other good feature is the antenna...some units appear to have an integrated antenna inside the unit so you avoid the cable and external one, do you know if these models are any good? Thanks!

[Carl]

Yannis- The Simrad I just bought has an integrated antenna, it finds the satellites faster than the Si-Tex I bought a few years ago with external antennae.

I bought my Simrad with chart plotter/GPS as it was the only depth finder (sonar) available, I bought my Si-tex GPS chart plotter with depth finder as it was the only GPS in my price range at the time. The Sitex came with the external antenna and no transducer...I was fine with that as I had the Furuno depth finder. But when that unit didn't start up this year I needed a depth finder...of course the transducers in the boat were not compatible and the stores I went to did not have the transducers I needed in stock, nor did they know when they would be able to get. So I bought the GPS to get the depthfinder.

In short...the combo units don't cost more I think its just a way to justify charging more for a cheap unit for loading more software into already made up circuitry. Then they add a cheap antenna or transducer knowing many will upgrade the transducer. Becomes a win win...then when unit dies it cost too much to fix so you buy a new piece of garbage.

OR you mortgage your home and buy top-shelf electronics with huge screens that are obsolete before you finish installing.

[pschauss]

I bought a Garmin Echomap Plus g3 94sv for the chart plotter function. The Humminbird 385ci which came with my boat gives me depth readings so I have not attempted to install the Garmin transducer yet. West Marine had the Garmin and Simrad units on sale and I chose the Garmin because I could get a larger screen for the same price.

One of the websites had a feature where you could get a demo of the Garmin display. After I played around with it on my laptop, making the window larger and smaller, I could see that anything less than a 9" diagonal screen was going to be difficult to use for navigation. Having used this unit now for about a month, I can confirm that it does exactly what I needed it to do. This particular model has buttons as well as touch screen controls. I had not really thought about this when I was looking at chart plotters, but when I am doing 20 knots on the bay I find that the on-screen controls to be a much easier way to interact with it, less time that I am taking my eyes off of my surroundings

[Yannis]

Carl, Peter,

Interesting stuff. Thanks.

Its clear you guys have a different use of electronics as you need both gps and a fishing aid.
In my case, all I need is to be able to go from a to b on a map. Now, if I can also have speed displayed and a few other gismos its a plus. I use navionics so I guess garmin would be a wiser choice.

I’ll wait for the next boat show where you can see many brands displayed simultaneously and where I might grab a deal.
As for the size, yeah the bigger the better, but my 7” simrad was ok, I had it installed in the center space where the compass was, of course a 9” is better than a 7”, but then again a 12” is yet better...until you realize it blocks your forward view completely! or as Carl says, until you mortgage your home ha ha!

[bob lico]

not as complicated as you think .your left (port) is at 45 degree angle to your forward view and that is a 12" display with Raster chart which shows depth and bottom contour than i use the digital radar as a overlay on the chart the radar will high light any boats on your course all other will be just targets. on the right side at 45 degrees to your line of sight will be your sonar on another independent 12" screen connected by common server this sonar will show depth of fish, size, direction and baitfish nearby also show bottom material as in sand, rocky. mud, grass and side scan shows wrecks in detail in the vertical position. look straight ahead and there is the ocean clear hell as the displays never interfere with forward vision.

[Tony Meola]

Yannis

Don't hold your breath for an in person boat show. This virus looks like it may cancel them here in the US.

We say Garmin, since the learning curve is fast, they are reliable and have good support.

Now as far as pricing, it seems every one sells them for the same price. The manufacturers seem to have the pricing dialed in so no one can deep discount them.

[Yannis]

Bob,

I thank you for your insight, but I have to explain:
I have nothing to do with fish, the fish direction, fishing in general, know the bottom contour, the depths, the wrecks etc.
A radar is completely useless, like a fridge in alaska, as we cruise between islands only during daylight, why on earth would we want to cruise at night, all islands are 10-20-30 miles apart, there is hundreds of them, so always visible. You exit a port or bay, you see the tip of the next island, you head towards it, done. The reason you need a gps is to avoid possible shallows and rocks that are mainly near the land or an island, never in the middle of the aegean.
I cannot turn my head at a 45 degree angle constantly as I cruise between rocks that are sometimes omnipresent. I want the screen right in front of me, so I removed the compass and put the gps up there; the screen has to be 9” max or else I have to stand up. Even a separate compass is an extreme redundancy as there is already a reading on the screen.
The passing boats you can see with your own eyes, there’s quite a few of them at times, but you don't need any device to display them on a screen for you, they're right there in front of you, there is never fog or rain, just plain sunshine and a deep blue sea and your destination is a few miles away, you never go out without a destination, there’s no other reason to use a boat than to go somewhere. Fishing is done by professional fishermen in their own boats or caiques, with nets or other devices that we never carry or want to carry, our boats are all liveaboards for vacations. The heaviest load is bottles of booze and ice for the drinks. Some clothes too. We use laundromats as we cruise along the islands. We buy our fish from the fishmonger or eat it at restaurants. Some retired elders might be going coastal fishing here and there in 3-4 meter boats for fun, we do that too, but never in our bertrams, they're too big for that.
Electronics are good for bigger yachts that may travel at night because they have to deliver paying tourists to a main port or airport. Or for guys that want to show off, half of whom don't even know how to use them.

I left yesterday to an island close to mine, 20 miles west. In the morning mist I couldn't even see its shape in the horizon. Had I left a bit later, the morning mist would have cleared and I would be able to clearly see it. I couldn't care less...I left port holding a rough westerly reading... some half an hour later the island shape appeared in the horizon, as I came closer I remembered the approximate location of the bay I wanted to go to , turned my wheel a bit, reached the bay, dropped anchor, secured the boat to a tree on the beach, swam with my friends, some went spearfishing, some went for sea urchins, we opened and ate them on the swim platform with ouzo or beer or wine, then went with the dinghy to the restaurant, had food and fun, came back to the boat, took a shower, a nap, put my clean shorts, went out in the evening to the main town...that’s what we do with boats. With very few exceptions.

Tony,

I know, but given my ignorance with all these contraptions, I need hands on experience in a boat show, someone to explain the pros and cons etc. Now whether I’ll buy it from there that’s another story, probably not, I’ll return home discuss it with the guys at the marina and...probably get it on Amazon!

[scenarioL113]

I know this is a HP thread but it seems to have gone towards electronics so I will chime in.

I got a Garmin ECHOMAP UHD 74CV this spring (2020). I also purchased the more detailed maps (additional $250) and well worth it. I never before had modern technology when it was still modern.

I have not installed a thruhull yet, but I will next season. For now the Transom Mount is in a huge glob of silicone in the bilge. I will tell you it works pretty damn good just the way it is!!!

It also has the active Captain feature which allows you to overlay community information on the charts (hazards depths shoaling etc...) I think that is what it does, I am not anywheres near an expert with these things.

With the detailed maps for me it has given me so much more confidence in unfamiliar areas. Also the detail on the reefs and wrecks is really amazing. I saw a party boat a few weeks back as I was heading to the Cholera (off Long Island) and saw he was anchored up. As we got into range I could see the detail images of the wreck on the detailed charts. ( I am not talking about the sonar here).

I would say I am very happy with unit so far. The nice thing about this particular unit is that it is touch screen BUT it also has a handful of buttons that you can use to navigate as well, so if your hands are wet and the touchscreen is not working so good you can use the buttons.

[Mark]

Back to this since I recently had to have my starboard prop replaced (slung a blade) this is with 21 x 23 3 blade props. Had the port prop tuned. Prop guy said there is a little cup in them also. (Big Rock Propellers in Morehead). That was running down the bay at slack tide...just over 2300 rpms. 26.3kts. On the way offshore...7/8 tank of fuel, 200lbs ice and 4 grown men, 25 gal water, tackle, bait, etc. Offshore we made 24.5kts at 2200 in a calm sea.

If the photo doesn't show up go to the imgur link here: https://imgur.com/mDUzJKo

Bradley,
Very interesting! I have the 270s running 19x25 3 blade nibrals (were already on the boat) that give me just over a knot per 100 rpm fully loaded. So at 2200 about 22.5. As I lighten up, speed will increase to about 23 or just over. What is your WOT rpm and speed? I turn 2695 and 2675. And your idle rpm and speed? I'm thinking that I can get better performance than what I have and the props you are running seem to be unique to what most others are running. The most common seems to be 20 x 22 4 blade.

[PeterPalmieri]

Bob,

I thank you for your insight, but I have to explain:
I have nothing to do with fish, the fish direction, fishing in general, know the bottom contour, the depths, the wrecks etc.
A radar is completely useless, like a fridge in alaska, as we cruise between islands only during daylight, why on earth would we want to cruise at night, all islands are 10-20-30 miles apart, there is hundreds of them, so always visible. You exit a port or bay, you see the tip of the next island, you head towards it, done. The reason you need a gps is to avoid possible shallows and rocks that are mainly near the land or an island, never in the middle of the aegean.
I cannot turn my head at a 45 degree angle constantly as I cruise between rocks that are sometimes omnipresent. I want the screen right in front of me, so I removed the compass and put the gps up there; the screen has to be 9” max or else I have to stand up. Even a separate compass is an extreme redundancy as there is already a reading on the screen.
The passing boats you can see with your own eyes, there’s quite a few of them at times, but you don't need any device to display them on a screen for you, they're right there in front of you, there is never fog or rain, just plain sunshine and a deep blue sea and your destination is a few miles away, you never go out without a destination, there’s no other reason to use a boat than to go somewhere. Fishing is done by professional fishermen in their own boats or caiques, with nets or other devices that we never carry or want to carry, our boats are all liveaboards for vacations. The heaviest load is bottles of booze and ice for the drinks. Some clothes too. We use laundromats as we cruise along the islands. We buy our fish from the fishmonger or eat it at restaurants. Some retired elders might be going coastal fishing here and there in 3-4 meter boats for fun, we do that too, but never in our bertrams, they're too big for that.
Electronics are good for bigger yachts that may travel at night because they have to deliver paying tourists to a main port or airport. Or for guys that want to show off, half of whom don't even know how to use them.

I left yesterday to an island close to mine, 20 miles west. In the morning mist I couldn't even see its shape in the horizon. Had I left a bit later, the morning mist would have cleared and I would be able to clearly see it. I couldn't care less...I left port holding a rough westerly reading... some half an hour later the island shape appeared in the horizon, as I came closer I remembered the approximate location of the bay I wanted to go to , turned my wheel a bit, reached the bay, dropped anchor, secured the boat to a tree on the beach, swam with my friends, some went spearfishing, some went for sea urchins, we opened and ate them on the swim platform with ouzo or beer or wine, then went with the dinghy to the restaurant, had food and fun, came back to the boat, took a shower, a nap, put my clean shorts, went out in the evening to the main town...that’s what we do with boats. With very few exceptions.

Tony,

I know, but given my ignorance with all these contraptions, I need hands on experience in a boat show, someone to explain the pros and cons etc. Now whether I’ll buy it from there that’s another story, probably not, I’ll return home discuss it with the guys at the marina and...probably get it on Amazon!

I love hearing about how you guys do your boating. Life is good.

[ktm_2000]

I agree - far too often I find myself rounding monomoy point from vineyard sound, water temps go from mid 70s to mid 60s and end up in pea soup thick fog.

Nevermind leaving the dock at 3am for fishing for first light or doing the flip side and going out at dusk for a night's fishing.

I've also had an event where I've had a GPS unit go out at night and had to come back on a combination of compass and radar.

I can not comprehend not having a good set of electronics and compass.

[pschauss]

I agree - far too often I find myself rounding monomoy point from vineyard sound, water temps go from mid 70s to mid 60s and end up in pea soup thick fog.

Nevermind leaving the dock at 3am for fishing for first light or doing the flip side and going out at dusk for a night's fishing.

I've also had an event where I've had a GPS unit go out at night and had to come back on a combination of compass and radar.

I can not comprehend not having a good set of electronics and compass.

Reminds me of "Luther Tarbox", a story that I used to read to my children, (https://www.amazon.com/Luther-Tarbox-Ja ... 0684149311). We identified with it because I used to sail Great South Bay on my Oday Mariner with only a compass for navigation.

[saburke17]

Bob your 315's have over 900ft lbs of torque?

[bob lico]

no not 900lbs. but 800 lbs for sure. incredible power to climb waves in a bad situation at sea and exactly why i removed the Yanmars.