New boat in my future for the new year?

Tail Chaser · Post by **Tail Chaser** » Jan 2nd, '20, 10:03

Wife is on board to "investing" in a boat for us! In 3 months my bills will be cut in half! The hardest part will be parting with my toys, I might need to sell my racetruck and will definitely have to sell the 38ft toyhauler.
I plan to trailer a 31 in Southern California, originally I wanted a 25 flybridge with outboards, but now really want a diesel 31. I could also see myself buying a beautiful gas boat and converting to outboards. My background is in Military helicopters, aircraft maintenance, and aerospace engineering. My skills are many but I am left in awe reading through many of the posts on this board... I dont see myself doing major fiberglass work or heavy diesel repairs, but I can do most all else.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/179-ixX ... p=drivesdk

Carl · Post by **Carl** » Jan 2nd, '20, 11:21

Look forward to seeing the new to you boat.

If going diesel 31 Bertram...once you finish tweaking her to fit your needs the price of ownership is cost of slip and your recreational activity fund. They run fairly economical with diesel. Even good gas motors don't break the bank for the occasional trips.

Just saying its something to consider when looking to give up the toys.
Bad weather activities need to be had with boats.

Tail Chaser · Post by **Tail Chaser** » Jan 2nd, '20, 11:25

I am set on keeping the boat at my house on the trailer... I suspect I will need to buy a custom trailer to make life much easier and probably will not only save headaches but money down the road to pony up and buy the best trailer possible.

Tony Meola · Post by **Tony Meola** » Jan 2nd, '20, 21:50

You will find the 31 easy to tow and if you do a search on the site you will find several posts about obtaining trailers or having one built and hauling a boat. Don't remember who, but in the last year or so, one of the members hauled one I believe it was Florida to his home in California.

I have Cummins in my 31. Repowered Diesel 31's are around and will save you a ton of money if you can get one already done.

Good luck in the search and look forward to seeing pics of the new ride.

Tail Chaser · Post by **Tail Chaser** » Jan 3rd, '20, 07:22

Tony Meola wrote:You will find the 31 easy to tow and if you do a search on the site you will find several posts about obtaining trailers or having one built and hauling a boat. Don't remember who, but in the last year or so, one of the members hauled one I believe it was Florida to his home in California.

I have Cummins in my 31. Repowered Diesel 31's are around and will save you a ton of money if you can get one already done.

Good luck in the search and look forward to seeing pics of the new ride.

Thank you, I did read quite a bit and did read that the only towing issues were it's actually wide! Not just wide at the top of the bow flare. And protect the propellers.

I am partial to Cummins only because my tow rig is a Ram, and that engine is flawless. What is too many engine hours? What kind of maintenance is required hours wise like for expensive preventative maintenance? Any tips on absolute red flags when it comes to Cummins engines?

Thanks again

Joseph Fikentscher · Post by **Joseph Fikentscher** » Jan 3rd, '20, 08:58

Kieth Poe is in Southern California and tows his 31 all over. Not sure if he frequents this site anymore, but he is on Facebook and has a sharktagger.com website. Search his posts here. Might help with trailer decisions.

neil · Post by **neil** » Jan 4th, '20, 14:03

Like tony said,find one that has been redone with cummins

Tony Meola · Post by **Tony Meola** » Jan 4th, '20, 22:35

The Cummins are pretty much bullit proof. Have not heard of any real issues with them. Taken care of, 10,000 hours is not unheard of.

Maintenance depends on the engine. The older 250/270 hp engines have fresh water cooled after coolers. Spreads out the maintenance on them. Otherwise, you have to have a regular cleaning schedule on them.

Mark · Post by **Mark** » Jan 7th, '20, 16:00

Not many around or should I say available with the Cummins. Many more available with Yanmar. Looking for the same myself. Maybe I'm not looking in the right places.

For some reason, I think I would prefer the earlier models but not sure it matters as has been stated in other posts.

You came to the right place to get help. The guys on this site are great!! (Minus me of course...LOL)

Good Luck!!
Mark

Tony Meola · Post by **Tony Meola** » Jan 7th, '20, 20:58

I am not sure if Vince has sold his 31 yet. He had it posted in the for sale section of the board. Worth taking a look at it. I don't remember which Cummins he had, I think they might have been the 315's.

Vince Luciani · Post by **Vince Luciani** » Jan 9th, '20, 15:13

Tony,

Thanks for the plug! My boat is still for sale and I have reduced the price to $42,750. I've had a lot of inquiries but no offers.

WAC · Post by **WAC** » Jan 9th, '20, 17:00

PM sent

Tail Chaser · Post by **Tail Chaser** » Jan 14th, '20, 19:50

Things are shaping up for us financially very nice right now. My wife is actually looking at boats... she "drug" me to the boat show... ha ha She wants a Boston whaler 315 or a Grady Marlin 300 now... ha ha So I am worried she might not appreciate a classic, unless it's $$$
We shall see, she knows it's what I want but she also knows I would drive either of the others and be happy too.

Daniel-J · Post by **Daniel-J** » Jan 15th, '20, 04:41

I wanted to buy myself a new boat for the new year, but it didn't work. There's money, so I resumed my search yesterday, hopefully this month will be lucky

Tail Chaser · Post by **Tail Chaser** » Feb 5th, '20, 19:41

We are still looking at boats... I am trying to get my wife on board with a bahia mar... kind of my new favorite... But as we keep searching she keeps leaning toward the Grady Whites, mostly because the lack of inventory. I do like a few of the boats on yacht world.
https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1961/b ... r-3607680/
And
https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1970/b ... --3544451/

Opinions
I love the flybridge but this particular boat has gas motors... is it overpriced considering everything else about the boat?

Tony Meola · Post by **Tony Meola** » Feb 5th, '20, 21:36

Both are nice boats, both look well cared for.

Right now for gas engines, the price is high. I am not sure about having the clutch's and throttles being on the same side. I would probably be uncomfortable with that, but that is me. I think the Bahia Mar guys can tell you about what it is like running the bahia mar vs the Fly Bridge.

I will say this, when I was 25, leaping off the bridge to the deck to help with a fish was never an issue. Now at 69, still not an issue, just not as quick. The bridge is not that high so I don't see it as an issue.

Actually, unless the used boat market has recovered both boats are over priced, but the diesel boat, not as much as the gasser.

Tail Chaser · Post by **Tail Chaser** » Feb 27th, '20, 22:23

Pretty Excited... I am getting a 31!
Ha ha so talking with my wife about boats and she says Why are you even showing me those I thought we decided on a Bertram!
Good girl! Love my wife (a lot of the time)
So my budget is $1k a month ish....
Just gotta wait for busy season to end. CPA wife wont be seen till April and refuses to add to her stress looking at boats.

Tony Meola · Post by **Tony Meola** » Feb 27th, '20, 22:28

So you are making an offer. Good luck. I am sure either one of them will work fine for you. Just make sure you get a survey.

Tail Chaser · Post by **Tail Chaser** » Feb 28th, '20, 05:29

Its close... I am going to make an offer on a different boat first then the bahia mar, then maybe the gasser. But I think i want the lower steering station.

Carl · Post by **Carl** » Feb 28th, '20, 07:27

Isn't the second boat jspiezio's fathers boat?
Looks about right, but I think his may have been done by Elite earlier.

The gas boat is priced high but looks impeccable from the pictures.

My only semi complaint is they did an incredible job with the interior. The woodworking looks fantastic; and while the 50 year old formica looks to be in great shape...its formica.

Its an interesting call...go to the boat show and find a 31' boat for that price and compare.
Now look for a seaworthy 31' boat with gas motors...inboard or outboard and compare to the 31' gas Bertram.

Play the game with diesel boats...then slightly used boats.

Now think if you purchase any of them...what will they be worth 10 years from now.
Provided of course you keep up with the maintenance and extra age related projects that may arise. Still have to keep in mind the boat may have celebrated its 50th birthday.

Over the past 25 years of going to boat shows, I walk out thinking even if I was able to broker a deal for half the asking price on any boat...I'd keep my boat instead.

Tail Chaser · Post by **Tail Chaser** » Feb 28th, '20, 08:34

Exactly.
My wife likes new, hell most people like new, it just feels clean and safe... That said I do not have access to $300k for a Boston whaler 315, or a Grady White Marlin 300... We could easily go used for an 8 year old boat but if I am looking and comparing I just love the used look of a Classic Bertram. If I get the gasser, it would need to be a price that I could afford to install outboards and I would love the opportunity to replace the formica with my own woodworking skills.

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Feb 28th, '20, 14:50

Spezio's boat is a 1/4 mile up the river from me. Sits on a lift, they seem to continue to take it out enough to keep the cob webs off. From what I know they take really good care of their boats and this Elite marine refit is top notch. The cockpit with livewell and fish boxes is great. Redesigned raised helm deck is well laid out. The big change to that boat is the rudders were moved to be aft mounted to change the angle of the shafts. It's a really great boat, if I didn't need an FBC to sleep 4 I otherwise have seriously considered selling mine to buy it.

Tail Chaser · Post by **Tail Chaser** » Feb 28th, '20, 17:05

That makes me feel really good about this boat. Between this one and Reel Lady, which do you think is a more solid boat... I am really torn, I love the look of the flybridge but like the functionality of the bahia, but Reel Lady has the lower steering station that makes things easier for me... Im kinda torn. My wife hates the Bahia looks, but says she will never go up on the flybridge, but likes the looks.... ha ha I know, I know.

pschauss · Post by **pschauss** » Feb 29th, '20, 11:08

My wife says the same thing about the flying bridge, but trying to drive from the lower station is next to impossible. There are just too many blind spots.

Stephan · Post by **Stephan** » Feb 29th, '20, 11:51

I think you are doing a good job of taking your time and enjoying the options available.
I have a FBC so there is no lower station. I remember clearly feeling like a chauffeur up on the bridge alone the first season we had the boat. However, with some changes in the seating and as we got more accustomed to our use of the boat that changed.
I believe if you are able to pay for a boat with the engines and running gear you want you are not only way ahead of what it would cost to convert but you also have the opportunity to use the boat for one or more seasons while you better understand how you will use it and how best to customize.
In any event, enjoy the ride and thanks for sharing it with us.
Stephan

Tail Chaser · Post by **Tail Chaser** » Feb 29th, '20, 12:33

Only because my wife controls the money!
Ha ha
I am pretty sure I would have bought that Oregon Boat and been dealing with those fixes.

But I do think I want to drive the boat around a season or two to figure out what changes I should make.

Carl · Post by **Carl** » Feb 29th, '20, 14:06

Stephan wrote:I think you are doing a good job of taking your time and enjoying the options available.
I have a FBC so there is no lower station. I remember clearly feeling like a chauffeur up on the bridge alone the first season we had the boat. However, with some changes in the seating and as we got more accustomed to our use of the boat that changed.
I believe if you are able to pay for a boat with the engines and running gear you want you are not only way ahead of what it would cost to convert but you also have the opportunity to use the boat for one or more seasons while you better understand how you will use it and how best to customize.
In any event, enjoy the ride and thanks for sharing it with us.
Stephan

wheres the "Like" button?

I think the best looking is the FBC, but most practical is the Express with the bahia mar somewhere in between.

FBC- Having the bridge is nice..but its snug for more then one. So if your running with guests your the pilot up top, no mingling. Kids...someone needs to keep an eye on them. When it rains your wet unless you enclose...if cold...your cold.

Bahia...Pilot and Co-pilot everyone else is down low. Your in the action, but also IN
Cabin...yeah, less then not much.

Exrpess- Two sets of seats and motor boxs allow others to stand next to you and see, join in conversation. Sides are open... Your in the mix of your guests, also great for fishing...one step to cockpit. Walk to the wheel with pole. Keep an eye on everyone in the boat.

Tail Chaser · Post by **Tail Chaser** » Feb 29th, '20, 16:05

I get the practicality of the express... but in no way can I deal with the looks. The FBC made me love the lines of the Bertram instantly, which made me learn about the handling advantages of the 31... Now that i know the 31 is a solid hull I can deal with the slightly less cool Bahia Mar... but the express just isn't going to happen.

Carl · Post by **Carl** » Mar 1st, '20, 09:56

Tail Chaser wrote: Now that i know the 31 is a solid hull I can deal with the slightly less cool Bahia Mar

... but the express just isn't going to happen.

Some consider the Bahia Mar the coolest of the cool and most beautiful design. I don't quite get it, know the design does not really work for me the way I want to use the boat but don't argue with those that want'em, have'em and love'em.

As to the Express...my dads friend bought a used 31 Bertram, 37 years ago. He was bringing it in from Connecticut
, some 60 miles away and we went down to the marina to greet him as he brought it in. I had always heard my dad talking about his dream boat the 31 Bertram, he'd point them out as we fished or visited other marina's and I looked forward to him pulling into the marina so I could get my first inside look. Then this blue and white boat shows up. The lines kinda look right, but no bridge and it's just a disappointment. I look inside boat and just amazed how small and sparse the cabin looks...great big cockpit though. Following year he paints the boat Desert Sand going a step further in the Cream tan trendy color at the time. Again me and dad were there for the unveiling. We had the same opinion...huh, he actually was able to make the boat look worse. Of corse we smiled and congratulated him on his job. Then on the way home me and dad laughed about the day he'd try to unload that brown beast, nobody in their right mind would ever buy it.
Fast forward 11 years, I just got married and my wife tells me our boat is too small, she wants something larger so we can fish offshore and vacation with the boat. I am running everyboat I can think of through my head. Most I cannot afford, the ones I can are clapped out unseaworthy dock party boats. I'm with my dock buddies thinking about boats and I see one of my customers "Frank" pull up at the end of the dock in his Bahia Mar, he was coming to show his friend the new teak deck he put in. So I grab my wife, ask her to take a look at a boat I have in mind...but it's not quite as good looking. I ask Frank if my wife could look at his boat, he shows her around his fishing machine...with a small cramped cabin she's ok with it. Next day at work I ask if dads friend "Bob" still had his boat for sale. A call is made, we go out to see the Old brown Beast...walking down the dock there it is and point out to my wife...and she keeps moving forward. Make our hellos and he shows her around. I look at fresh water system. Clipped hoses, painted over deck my plate. Shore power, clipped lines, panel removed. No automatic bilge pumps as he didn't believe in them. Ice box, filled with a case of oil and filters. Motors I knew were good as he and my dad pulled their motors to have rebuilt by a friends shop not too long ago. A quick ride, we say by, thanks for his time and we leave. I'm waiting for my wife to rip me a new one for showing her this boat. But she asks if I can put water and electric in...can carpet and cushions be changed...can the boat be taken offshore...can it go to Fire Island, the beach, take our friends...can we afford. With a yes to all she said buy it.
...and that was it. Made the call and I was the poor owner who bought that brown beast. I played with the colors a little, updated the systems, added a short tower and I have to say it's been the perfect boat for us for 25 years. I still prefer the looks of the FBC over mine, but the Express just works so much better...for me.

You can't make a bad choice. Good hull good motors your always getting back and going out when many others are heading back.

Tail Chaser · Post by **Tail Chaser** » Mar 1st, '20, 10:53

I have seen a few that are restored really nice... And I would be affraid if I actually tried one on for size that I would like it... but yeah I love the lines on the Flybridge. It is truly confidence inspiring to hear that its hard to go wrong with these boats, other than affecting resale value.

Oldcreek · Post by **Oldcreek** » Mar 1st, '20, 19:01

Great story, Carl!

PeterPalmieri · Post by **PeterPalmieri** » Mar 2nd, '20, 09:19

Thanks for sharing Carl

Tony Meola · Post by **Tony Meola** » Mar 2nd, '20, 20:55

Carl'

Great Story.

Actually pretty funny.

Did you ever consider naming her the Brown Beast just for sentimental reasons.

Captain Decent · Post by **Captain Decent** » Mar 3rd, '20, 23:14

Funny, I went from a GW Marlin to a Bertram 31 FBC. Wife didn’t care for the GW. Loves the Bert.

Forget the lower helm. Sometimes I’d like the drive from inside (I live in Washington state) but I can’t imagine trying to drive from down there. I’ll take the sleet to the face.

If you need any info on the trailer let me know. I just set one up. I used the diagram shown on this site. Either I don’t know how to read or it is lacking because I had to reconfigure it. But it’s set now.

I am on Facebook also on the Bertram groups. I was gonna post a trailer tutorial soon. Not that I’m an expert but I have a few things to share.

As for motors I went to the east coast to find one with low hour yanmars (I would have “settled” for Cummins also). Cost me $11000 to ship and another $6 or 700 to survey but it opens up a lot more options as there just aren’t any over here.

Tail Chaser · Post by **Tail Chaser** » Mar 4th, '20, 07:12

Thank you for the great information everyone, I really appreciate it. I am leaning hard toward the Bahia Mar at first the look was so so, but now I am really diggin the looks.

One of my thoughts on driving from inside. If you are driving blind anyway. (Auto pilot, radar, and flir, at night, in the fog and basically using electronics) why not hang with everyone on the drive, but still be able to grab the wheel if you see something pop up?

ranjr13 · Post by **ranjr13** » Mar 4th, '20, 07:50

Agree that the FBC has the best lines, but the Express is incredibly functional, easier to single handle, and you're part of the party. I think you can do things to modify the looks with enclosure, etc. We added gin pole for radar and FLIR, and walk through door in transom, plus tons of other upgrades. Looks very good, but something about the FBC gets my attention.

.

Carl · Post by **Carl** » Mar 4th, '20, 08:58

Tail Chaser wrote:Thank you for the great information everyone, I really appreciate it. I am leaning hard toward the Bahia Mar at first the look was so so, but now I am really diggin the looks.

One of my thoughts on driving from inside. If you are driving blind anyway. (Auto pilot, radar, and flir, at night, in the fog and basically using electronics) why not hang with everyone on the drive, but still be able to grab the wheel if you see something pop up?

When driving blind my eyes are peeled to trying to see what I can't...just in case I can.

My .02...looking and imagining what its like to drive and use the boat is alot different then getting out and experiencing one.

I love a bridge for visibility and just being out in the elements, over it all.
But that can get old when Suns beating on you, when cold, when raining...when everyone is downstairs enjoying themselves.

A lower helm like a Bahia Mar or Express is great to get out of the elements, great to see whats happening all though the boat, great fishing short handed and nice when hanging with a bunch of people for a howdy cruise. Down side is your stuck inside...opening windows or lowering a bimini is not the same as being up on a bridge. Then comes...even with the best sound insulation, you have motor noise to deal with.

I have yet to drive or see anyone drive from inside the cabin on any boat that has had a lower inside station...
Some may...just not something I've seen.

From what I started saying...my .02 - If your shopping, go out and sea trial a few even if you don't want to buy them.
Or at least sit at the helm and go Broom broom

pschauss · Post by **pschauss** » Mar 4th, '20, 10:05

The first time I drove my boat, going from the boat yard in Sayville to Oakdale, I used the lower helm because the starter button on the flying bridge did not work. (This was, literally, the first time I had ever driven a power boat.) Despite the fact that I had had more than forty years experience with a sailboat on the Great South Bay and I knew all of the landmarks, I managed to drive right past the mouth of the Connetquot River. You just cannot see anything from the lower station.

Tony Meola · Post by **Tony Meola** » Mar 4th, '20, 21:48

A friend of ours 31 had the lower station. I never liked running it from down there. You had trouble seeing anything floating in the water. In fact in all the years we knew him, I don't remember him ever running it from down there. I know one time in the rain he hit a buoy. I think that cured him from using the lower station.

Joseph Fikentscher · Post by **Joseph Fikentscher** » Mar 5th, '20, 09:40

I removed the lower station on my 25. Never used it.

Amberjack · Post by **Amberjack** » Mar 5th, '20, 14:21

25 years of driving the Bertram 31 Amberjack and I've used the lower helm station twice--and been very happy to have it. First time in a torrential downpour in Elliott Bay, Seattle. Knew where I was, no traffic and no channel to worry about so I put it in idle and kept going from down below. Visibility was OK at 6 knots. This was simply a comfort factor and I could have gotten by up on the bridge although wet.

The second time a couple years ago we were off Point No Point in Admiralty Inlet when we starting seeing lightning in the distance. All of a sudden it got really close so we jumped off the bridge and down to the lower helm where we felt a lot safer and could still control the boat. In that situation the only other alternative would have been to shut down the engines and go below to ride it out.