Head Rebuild Help

[JohnV8r]

Guys,

I got this information earlier today regarding rebuild of the heads on Shambala that were damaged by the ethanol issue:

"I just wanted to give you an update on where we are at currently. The machine shop is not confident that the heads are in good enough shape to machine and reuse. They have located three re-manufactured cylinder heads, but are having trouble with the fourth. I hope to have a solid answer from them by Friday."

Anyone have any options or recommendations for rebuilt heads for 454's? Are there not options available from after market manufacturers like Edelbrock?

Thanks in advance.

JohnV8r

[Bruce]

John,
What are they saying the issue with the heads are?
Are your heads fresh or raw water cooled?

[Carl]

Re-manufactured are available unless you have some special sort of 454's...maybe just not through the people they prefer to use.

I love the new catch phrase- "re-manufactured"...whatever happened to rebuilt heads?
Bad connotation...I guess this term is meant to be a different color lipstick on the pig.

[longfin]

I thought you were doing a Diesel repower ? I just went through a similar experience with the 12V92's in my 54. 4 of the 8 cylinder heads were bad at the injector tube. No new Detroit heads available fortunately they are the same heads as 6V92's. I'm pretty sure BBC heads are pretty prevalent, they only made a few million of them.

[JohnV8r]

My engines are freshwater cooled.

The issue as it was explained to me is that there is corrosion where the heads meets the block. They soaked the heads over the weekend in some type of acid bath to try to clean the corrosion up. However, as you saw from the information I got they are not confident about reusing these heads.

I may try to go down and have them show me the corrosion just to make sure they are not using "corrosion" as a catch all excuse for not wanting to have to deal with the resin from the ethanol.

I'm just trying to understand what my options are at this point given they are reporting only being able to find 3 of 4 necessary heads. I see both aluminum and steel heads for what appears to be the Series 72 generation 454's.

Diesel repower is on hold until I get my kids through college. I was hoping to spent $7-$10k to get 4-6 more years out of the 454's without having to feel like I was dipping into money I had set aside for getting my kids through college.

[Yannis]

John,
What is better, repower my 28 or buy a new boat?
I'll sell my 350h almost new yanmars and will buy identical new, which with new shafts, better motor accommodation etc. will cost so much.
Or, I buy a new boat for probably the same amount.

Is there a sentimental parameter beyond the numbers? Can you quantify it? All this to tell you that your daughters will do fine and you should too!
I also like the way you present and explain things, even I myself can understand!
Enjoy your choice.

[Bruce]

If the blocks were fresh water cooled there should be no corrosion anywhere in the block or heads cooling passages.

The only corrosion issue could be would be exhaust port to manifold surface. I've seen the port faces rust to the point of you can't get a good seal anymore even with a gasket. If that's not it, anything else is suspect.

[JohnV8r]

Bruce,

You are exactly correct. It is the exhaust ports that are the issue. The machine shop gave me the full explanation today.

They also said they are confident they will find a fourth reconditioned head. The big question is whether to get reconditioned heads that they build or aftermarket heads that are more expensive, but already built.

[Tony Meola]

John

What type of warranty are on both type of heads and what is the cost difference? That could make your decision easier. I bet they only give you 90 days on the re-conditioned heads. Probably 12 months on the others. Then if the price is lets say $100 go with the newer ones.

[Navatech]

John

What type of warranty are on both type of heads and what is the cost difference? That could make your decision easier. I bet they only give you 90 days on the re-conditioned heads. Probably 12 months on the others. Then if the price is lets say $100 go with the newer ones.

AFAIK the warranty on automotive spare parts is only 90 days... Might be different for aftermarket parts... Especially when coming from a big name like Edelbrock... Having said that, AFAIK Edelbrock doesn't do steel heads... Only aluminum... But yes, if you can find new steel heads from a reputable vendor with a longer warranty for a relatively small premium then that's the way to go...

[Carl]

Those warranties are great if your doing job yourself. Its "only" your labor of pulling everything off, hauling heads to shop for rework...then bring back, new gaskets and reinstall everything again.

Have to pay someone to do that...well so much for warranty saving you.


My money is on someone or someplace that gets the heads done right the first time. Stuff like that bites me in the arse every time...

[Tooeez]

Check Clearwater Cylinder Head in Florida. I got a rebuilt sbc head from then a few years back at a reasonable price, including shipping to NY.

[Tony Meola]

Those warranties are great if your doing job yourself. Its "only" your labor of pulling everything off, hauling heads to shop for rework...then bring back, new gaskets and reinstall everything again.

Have to pay someone to do that...well so much for warranty saving you.


My money is on someone or someplace that gets the heads done right the first time. Stuff like that bites me in the arse every time...

Then I guess the guy the Gas Monkey Garage use's is out.

But you are correct, they need to be done right the first time, but remember stuff happens. Since I grew up around cars and engines, with my father teaching me how to grind in the valves, I found, there sometimes is that one valve or seat, maybe 100 heads down the line that goes bad. Seems I always manage to find that one part.

I can not count how many times someone has said to me, never had that happen before.

[Carl]

I can not count how many times someone has said to me, never had that happen before.

I have heard that so many times its not funny.


Friend/customer/mechanic does a good amount of engine swaps. If he gets the motor or has the work done he stands behind it...yes it is a few bucks more going through him. If you hire him to pull, then you have motor rebuilt or buy on your own...that is fine too. He charges for the pull and the install...however many times it takes. Lots of people get great internet deals or they bring to cheapest re builder...yes they are under warranty...but the item has to be removed and brought back to them for rework. Case and point, dads 440's...had to pull motor 3-4 times as the rear main rope seal leaked. Excuse was rope seals were an oddity...reverse rotation was even more so. Whatever the case the answer was...sorry, bring it back we will take care of it.


Sorry for hyjack...I am sure the right heads will be located, done right and you'll be good to go. Gotta love ethanol....not bad in a glass, just not in gas or fiberglass.

[1962 31]

I also use Clearwater cylinder head at my shop
have probably used 30 or so heads from them and only a problem with one of em